this post was submitted on 07 Jun 2026
834 points (98.6% liked)

Technology

85274 readers
5466 users here now

This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.


Our Rules


  1. Follow the lemmy.world rules.
  2. Only tech related news or articles.
  3. Be excellent to each other!
  4. Mod approved content bots can post up to 10 articles per day.
  5. Threads asking for personal tech support may be deleted.
  6. Politics threads may be removed.
  7. No memes allowed as posts, OK to post as comments.
  8. Only approved bots from the list below, this includes using AI responses and summaries. To ask if your bot can be added please contact a mod.
  9. Check for duplicates before posting, duplicates may be removed
  10. Accounts 7 days and younger will have their posts automatically removed.

Approved Bots


founded 3 years ago
MODERATORS
top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] Sam_Bass@lemmy.world 5 points 10 hours ago

bastard musk must be broken down to destitution to clean up our world

[–] dropped_the_chief@lemmy.world 2 points 8 hours ago* (last edited 8 hours ago)

I'm loathe to find out how he's going to fail his way upwards from this. It's going to pop, and he's going to tumble upwards like he always does. Capitalism is a system that props fools like this up.

[–] VAK@lemmy.world 1 points 8 hours ago

How much does it have to grow before Musk dies? That'll be the question

[–] Inucune@lemmy.world 2 points 10 hours ago

Better start hauling asteroids for mining. Nothing else is going to have that level of ROI.

[–] brachiosaurus@mander.xyz 21 points 1 day ago (2 children)

All they have to do is to start putting ads on space and none of us will be able to do anything about it because we are a bunch of peasants.

[–] racemaniac@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 17 hours ago* (last edited 17 hours ago) (2 children)

Just so you know: the valuation of SpaceX has nothing to do with the space side of the company. If you look at their projected revenue, the rockets etc... are a footnote. but SpaceX acquired XAI, and literally all of this projected growth is SpaceX becoming the leading AI company in the next decade.

(and i wish i was joking, but i see everybody here wondering how a space company could possible grow that much, or be expected to. And the answer obviously is it can't, and noone expects it to. But an AI company in this AI bubble, that people believe....)

[–] jj4211@lemmy.world 4 points 10 hours ago (1 children)

Remember, Musk also proposes a combination. That AI will, for whatever stupid ass reason, become predominantly space based and that they would be having hundreds of Starship launches a month....

[–] chilicheeselies@lemmy.world 5 points 8 hours ago (2 children)

That's another Elon BS special. Dissapating heat in space is very difficult because you can only do it via radiation, which is weak.

[–] dltk@lemmy.world 3 points 8 hours ago

Then there's the massive amounts of heavy metals that get deposited in the upper atmosphere when the satellite datacenters ultimately reenter and burn up. Good bye ozone layer.

[–] jj4211@lemmy.world 1 points 7 hours ago

Yeah, there's a lot of stupidity at the concept.

If I recall, his rationalization was that a particular company was backordered on parts to build natural gas generators until 2030... So naturally it's so much easier to get to hundreds of starship launches a month and all the attendant solar and radiators and crap....

[–] AA5B@lemmy.world 1 points 10 hours ago

I wonder the opposite: when the ai bubble pops, will it take spacex with it?

[–] 7101334@lemmy.world 11 points 1 day ago

We can burn the hypothetical companies which obstruct our heavens.

[–] anon_8675309@lemmy.world 54 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Why do people like this guy? Tell him to fuck off already.

[–] brachiosaurus@mander.xyz 12 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Because he has a massive public presence. Why do people like mcdonald and not burgermeister? Because they have never hear of the latest. The proper way to give this guy the middle finger is to stop giving him any exposure if not for serious stuff that show he's scum.

[–] tomiant@piefed.social 2 points 10 hours ago

Because he has $826 billion....

[–] reksas@sopuli.xyz 26 points 1 day ago (2 children)

why people invest in this? they will just lose their money

[–] SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world 27 points 1 day ago (1 children)

As long as there is a sucker willing to pay more they will gain money. And unfortunately there are millions of suckers on the planet. Fundamentals don’t mean anything with this IPO. It’s basically all hype based like Pokemon cards.

[–] explodicle@sh.itjust.works 18 points 1 day ago (5 children)

One of the big problems with investing is that the average investor thinks they're smarter than the average investor.

load more comments (5 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[–] Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com 34 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (10 children)

Now that even main Indices (which were supposed to be much safer to invest in - via things like ETFs - than individual stock picking) are being shamelessly rigged to feed Retail and Fund money to the IPO pires, you should literally not be invested in any US Stock Market by the time this and other AI IPOs happen.

Literally even having money under your matress (even with the current inflation) is safer than being in any way form or shape invested in the Nasdaq 100 and if this shit is the straw that breaks the camel's back, matress savings storage is safer that being invested anywhere in a US stock market.

I was in none other than Lehman Brothers in the 2008 Crash and saw that shit from the front row and all of this crap (the ever more articles about how AI is not delivering returns for companies using it, the steep increases in AI usage fees - which stink of desperate attempts at monetising it, which in turn mean that either the companies selling AI services have run out of runway or believe AI cannot improve further hence their investment must start producing returns NOW - these 3 AI IPOs pretty much at the same time all with insane valuations and the shameless rigging of Indices) are making alarm bells ring in my head like crazy.

Think of it as alarmism if you want.

I can tell you one thing for sure from my own experience in 2008 Crash: there were but a few obscure signs that shit was about to hit the fan back then (for example, there was an article in The Economist about how the Credit Derivative positions of both Bear Stearns and Lehman Brothers were 2x higher than the 3rd largest and the rest of the Industry, plus some wispers of Goldman Sachs reducing their exposure to Credit Derivatives) and between that and the first big crack - Bear Stearns collapsing and being sold the JPMorgan for peanuts - it was but a few weeks and between that and Lehman Brothers going bankrupt and the markets going into an uncrontrolled crash, it was about a week, so expect the same kind of time scale in the transition from "this all looks kinda suspicious" to the first "oh shit" (maybe OpenAI's IPO?!) to an out of control fall of the markets that no matter what they try Central Banks are unable to stop until it hits a stable new and much lower level, and meanwhile all that shit will be throwing shrapnel into the rest of the Economy, not just via retraction in Financial Markets such as the Money Markets but via the complete collapse of everything proped up by the current data center projects (most of which not even yet started yet already propping up things like land acquisition and long term equipment purchasing contracts).

Judging by how P/Es in the Nasdaq 100 are now literally TWICE as much as in 2022, in the least bad scenario the Nasdaq market will collapse to half its value right now as P/E levels go back to 2022 (which was much closer to historic average), though judging by my experience in 2008 Crash plus there being other massive asset price bubbles in other markets (such as realestate), IMHO as the the bursting of the bubbles feed each other and impact the broader Economy which in turn impacts back all kinds of markets - via retractions in Consumption and Investment as well as spiking Loan Default rates in turn feeding into retractions in credit from traditional Banks and Money Markets - this shit will go much further than a mere 50% fall in the Nasdaq).

[–] chilicheeselies@lemmy.world 2 points 8 hours ago

I started to invest in world market ex us funds over a year ago. I also have been stockpiling cash

[–] megopie@lemmy.blahaj.zone 11 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

I think a lot of people will brush it off what ever happens with SpaceX because Xai is the weakest of the big model providers. I don’t think we’ll even get to the openAI IPO. I think the S1 or IPO from anthropic will be the real kicker, because they’re the darling at the moment. The one that seems to have the most momentum and business customers.

If their S1 turns out to be utter dog water and/or their IPO flops, that’s when the real panic comes. When people say “oh crap, these GPU data centers don’t have customers that can make money”, and that narrative will hit all the people building data center and all the people selling hardware to them. Amazon, Google, Microsoft, Nvidia, that’s like… what, 25% of the S&P 500? That seems like a big enough hit to catch a lot of other stuff in the blast radius.

[–] isleepinahammock@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 1 day ago (2 children)

What do you think about value mutual funds like these?

https://www.schwab.com/research/mutual-funds/tools/schwab-funds/index-funds/fundamental

I'm moving most of my US stock holdings to these funds. It's still US market exposure, so there will be some risk from the AI bubble. But the key thing is that these indices are not trying to track the Dow Jones, the NASDAQ, etc. They don't actively manage funds - they don't pick winners and losers. They are a passive investment blindly applying uniform rules - just like index funds. However, they don't weight by market cap. Instead they weight stocks in the index based on fundamental values - actual sales, retained earnings, book value, etc. The actual share price of the companies isn't factored in at all. And you can't even get into one of these indices until your company is profitable.

The expense ratios are higher than I'm used to. The low-cost index funds I've traditionally used have expense ratios more like 0.01-0.02%. This is 0.25%. This is still well below the 1% most managed funds use. But that is a downside of this.

With how tightly the whole global financial system is tied together, I'm not under any illusions that moving to these funds will eliminate my exposure to the AI bubble. But I hope at least to ameliorate it.

[–] captainlezbian@lemmy.world 1 points 9 hours ago

I recently moved a decent chunk of money to municipal bonds. Is it guaranteed to be safe? No. But it's a good way to wait out chaos. If cities can't pay their debts the market is in really bad shape, but not necessarily vice versa. And it avoids the "everyone sees the economy is about to crash" premium that you're currently paying for precious metals.

[–] Aceticon@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 12 hours ago* (last edited 10 hours ago)

My savings are mainly in Gold. Actual physical gold, in a vault, in Switzerland, not some kind of paper gold certificate that's supposedly equivalent to the real thing but in fact is just a contract with a company with all the associated risks of it for a piece of paper that supposedly tracks the value of gold.

That position is a massive rejection of the entire Financial system, Gold being it's own currency and a really old one at that - essentially I'm positioned to counter the devaluation of the very fiat currencies in which investment assets are priced, mainly because I don't trust how they and the nations backing them are managed. (I'm in that position since 2012 and I would say that what's going on in the US is kinda proving that view I've had since then). Putting money in agricultural land would be a similar position, that that has geographical (and thus country and climate) risk plus I'm not quite ready to become a prepper.

So most of my savings are literally outside any main currency such that I'm basically shorting main currencies.

(You see, I worked in the Finance Industry for almost a decade and it's kinda like working in a sausage factory: once you see how they're made you stop wanting to eat them)

Mind you, I have a very long investment horizon - 14 years now and counting, with a return of so far around 500% vs the EUR - and whilst Gold is currently sliding down since its all time peak at the end of January, it's price now back to the level of the start of the year, that's fine when one is sitting on 14 years of gains and not really aiming to take money out until retirement, since in the current fucked up deregulated shit that passes for a Financial System nowadays there will be plenty of financial crisis in the meantime and Gold invariably goes up when shit hits the fan, the worse it is the more it goes up.

If your investment horizon is shorter, things are different.

Now, outside this specific ultra-low risk position I'm in, I'm not going to advise you on specific funds - all that stuff works as legal contracts in that to really know the risks you're taking you have to read the small print plus as we've seen from the changes to the Nasdaq 100 index rules, there's even more contracts under those contracts and they can even change those from under you to fuck you up.

Obviously I'm not gonna read the small print of that for you.

So here's a few more general things you probably should consider:

  • Try and go for things that reduce the number of intermediaries between you and the value you're invested in. Every intermediary adds risk (not just of shenanigans but also of them just going bankrupt - a lesson I learned in 2008). Holding physical Gold is maybe a bit extreme but it certainly reduces the number of intermediaries (though I personally use a custodian, accepting the risk added by having that single intermediary).
  • By all appearences the cycle of empire for the US is at an end and by all indications China will be next. If you're going with traditional and more liquid investment classes, you might want to be exposed to China stuff. I'm in Europe and, frankly, I suspect Europe will be dragged down by the US - maybe not fall as bad as the US but certainly it's not going to come out unscatted. Keep in mind that the time horizon for it to happen is unclear (maybe some years, maybe one or two decades) - I mean, it's happenning, but not very fast yet.
  • Spread your eggs across several baskets: in other words, diversify your investments, even across investment classes, in case something goes wrong. Diversity is robustness. I still have a little actual cash at home (for things like interruption of access to electronic payment systems, like it happenned recently with a long blackout) and money in bank accounts in more than one country (and in different currencies if one counts Gold as a currency).

There's this phrase from the goldbug community (yeah, I know, but sometimes even some of those fanboys have a point) which goes roughly like this: when things get rough it's not the Return On Investment you should worry about, its the Return Of (The) Investment.

load more comments (7 replies)
[–] jobbies@lemmy.zip 28 points 1 day ago (8 children)

This is nuts. Can someone explain this cos I just don't get it. Why would you invest in a company if its well established that its unlikely you'll ever make a profit or even get that money back??

[–] jj4211@lemmy.world 1 points 10 hours ago

Because Elon said so, and a lot of these people are playing with other people's money, so it's worth a shot.

Elon says:

  • SpaceX is really about xAI, and look how well regarded Anthropic is, we'll be even better than Anthropic because, welll I'm Elon and I said so!
  • All this AI stuff has to go to space because some company that makes a part for natural gas generators is backordered a few years, so we'll start having hundreds of Starship launches a month.

Yes, he claimed that hundreds of Starship launches a month is a more realistic thing to pull off than making some parts of natural gas turbines...

[–] ExLisper@lemmy.curiana.net 39 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (3 children)
  1. Buy stock when it's valued at $1.75 trillion
  2. Elon says on twitter he thinks it will be worth $3 trillion soon
  3. Some idiots buy stock, price goes up
  4. You sell
  5. Profit

You can keep doing this as long as there's a bigger idiot down the line. If you're still holding the stock when it collapses you're the biggest idiot and you lose.

[–] Triasha@lemmy.world 26 points 1 day ago* (last edited 8 hours ago) (3 children)

SpaceXs initial valuation is so large it will distort the market, and they changed the rules so the index funds will all buy shares automatically to balance their portfolios, which will shoot the price up and balloon the valuation even further, then Elon and the investors that helped him buy twitter can sell at ludicrous prices at the expense of American 401ks and and passive managed pension funds.

It's a trillion dollar rug pull in broad daylight.

Edit- Nasdaq changed their rule, S&P has not.

[–] explodicle@sh.itjust.works 6 points 1 day ago

Surely the SEC will shut down these shenanigans! /s

load more comments (1 replies)
[–] DupaCycki@lemmy.world 14 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Tl;dr - Not a single person would be investing in SpaceX. Americans' retirement funds would be invested into it, without their knowledge or consent, regardless of how obvious the outcome is.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (5 replies)
[–] formergijoe@lemmy.world 49 points 1 day ago (11 children)

I can't wait for my 401k to lose a significant chunk of its value within the next 5 years because some chud at Fidelity needed to ride Elon to the moon. And also the AI crash.

[–] tomiant@piefed.social 1 points 10 hours ago

I just wish my money would all be gone already so I didn't have to worry so much.

[–] galbraith@lemmy.world 30 points 1 day ago (1 children)

The S&P 500 rejected adding SpaceX though. So no worries from them but when AI crashes and burns so will your 401k.

[–] dhork@lemmy.world 11 points 1 day ago (1 children)

They didn't reject adding SpaceX, they simply said they would not change the rules to add it early, like the other indexes are. Those rules include a minimum time listed as a public company, a certain percentage of shares being floated to the public, and some profitability. I doubt SpaceX ever gets there.

Some of those other AI companies might make it through the gauntlet, though, and be listed eventually.

load more comments (1 replies)
load more comments (9 replies)
[–] Greyghoster@aussie.zone 114 points 1 day ago (35 children)

Never understood the business model for SpaceX and Starlink. Huge capital and operational costs without a clear understanding of who is paying for it.

[–] Juviz@lemmy.zip 68 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (16 children)

For Starlink and SpaceX, I can probably understand the business model, considering the race to getting more satellites to orbit be it for surveying or in case of Starlink stable Internet anywhere. But anything beyond that, like data centers in space I just ridiculous. No way that their valuation is anywhere near what it is realistically.

load more comments (16 replies)
load more comments (34 replies)
[–] Strider@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago

But, but... Money laundering err I mean mars!

load more comments
view more: next ›