this post was submitted on 20 Aug 2026
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[–] AlteredEgo@lemmy.ml 7 points 13 hours ago* (last edited 13 hours ago) (3 children)

Obviously fuck Meta, but the difference is the publishing. Scraping and copying for personal or business use is a civil matter. And machine learning from unlicensed material is also fine - as long as the material isn't "memorized" and an AI model can't reproduce it.

Aaron bravely published the papers which is a criminal matter. That is why I believe copyright and IP law is the real theft, they take down copies for people to learn from.

There are many many millions of people who read and learned from pirated textbooks and who use those skills to do things. Who watched pirated amines or comics use that to learn how to draw.

Basically we should not be siding with the unethical side of IP law just to oppose AI corporations. They can afford to buy the books and media, and a simple purchase will do. And they can afford the lawsuits. And they will figure out the memorization problem, so that AI models learn but not memorize (which is only happens in like 1% of the cases and only when you specifically ask for something "just like that").

China (so far) is saying that the AI models they produce should be open weight and be available to all people on earth. So if we have any issues it should be with the monopolization of AI models that concentrate this new developing immense power of AI in the hands of a few plutocrats. Which the IP laws might actually help them with.

[–] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 4 hours ago* (last edited 4 hours ago) (1 children)

Basically we should not be siding with the unethical side of IP law just to oppose AI corporations.

Why not? There is nothing ethical under capitalism. The system is literally destroying the planet. Normal people need to use whatever tools they can just to have a chance.

[–] AlteredEgo@lemmy.ml 2 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

Lets say IP law is extended or reinterpreted to include that machine learning from book or papers or articles or comments requires a special license, even assuming the memorization problem is solved. This is what anti ai seems to be arguing.

This would then result in some kind of "deal". Producers of AI models are required to pay some kind of overall license fee or percentage into some kind of public fund. Even Bernie Sanders suggested something like that. The problems I see:

  1. The AI corporations can afford this and it will not really impact them in any way. The prices for AI rise a little. Free access is reduced.
  2. Open Weight models may no longer be used freely. You could still pirate a Chinese one but while capitalists have access to any potential benefits in replacing labor with AI, for ordinary people it becomes an additional form of rent.
    Also in combination with advances in robotics, these AI models could do a lot to allow people to become "independent" by just telling your $6000 robot (actual price for a humanoid robot in china today) to plant some potatoes and vegetables there there and there, then clean the house etc. Or DIY build your own out of plywood, servos and a smartphone once technology advances.
  3. The government through that fund gains an active interest in protecting that source of incoming and increase AI use, even if it does replace workers.
    This happened with the tobacco funds when vaping came around. Governments had leveraged the future payouts of these funds with banks for short term payouts and would have been in big trouble if vaping actually reduced smoking significantly.
[–] rustydrd@sh.itjust.works 7 points 8 hours ago* (last edited 8 hours ago)

He didn't publish them, as far as I know. The charges brought against him were centered around the allegedly "fraudulent" use of his JSTOR account and the fact that he downloaded the files from the premises of an institution he did not belong to by plugging his laptop in a network switch in a restricted area where he wasn't allowed to be. The actual deed was minor, likely not even criminal as far as digital rights were concerned, and the charges were famously so out of proportion that even other attorneys and legal scholars questioned them publicly. The publishers wanted to make an example, and it drove Swartz into suicide before a proper trial could be held.

Meta and other companies do essentially the same thing at a much larger scale and with the clear intent to monetize it through publishing AI models built on top of it all. The main difference is the legal climate, which has changed since/due to Swartz, and the lack of clarity that the law has for these new applications. Substantively though, there is a good bit of hypocrisy here, and it makes sense to point this out.

[–] UnityDevice@lemmy.zip 2 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

Aaron bravely published the papers

I don't think he did.

[–] kestrel7_7@lemmy.world 1 points 4 hours ago

I thought that was where a bunch of the initial core of libgen/anna’s archive was from? Maybe I’m wrong