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Side rant:
To make it worse, SMS is incredibly insecure. Nothing should send you codes via SMS, and if you have the option to use an authenticator app, do that. It's atrocious so many banks only have SMS as an option.
The really dumb part is, the SMS codes are literally the same authenticator algorithm, but running on their servers and sent to you via an insecure medium.
And one little lapse in not paying a cell phone bill can cause you to lose your phone number, which then means you can no longer authenticate.
this is why I don't like it and why I often advocate that countries should provide a secure email that you can come to an office in person if you can't get to it. People get mad as if Im suggesting it should be the only email they have but what I really want is a guaranteed thing that is made as secure as possible and allows for real in person support to make sure you can get access or stop someone that somehow got access.
This shit drives me nuts. I've put in a lot of effort to secure my accounts but a number of them require SMS without any opt out. We have known about the risks of SMS plenty long enough at this point.
I never understood why SMS is insecure, are you saying it's easy to intercept someone's number? How would that even work without the SIM?
Getting a replacement SIM from the phone company is often shockingly easy, just a tiny bit of social engineering. And then you have access to the number and everything that 2FA "protects"
It is but only if you are targeted. I completely disagree with people who say it’s insecure because most attacks are remote and in bulk. Which your password they can login from any browser but are stopped by the SMS code.
For the SMS code they can use mostly automated social engineering to trick a certain percentage into giving it up.
However while A SIM attack may be easy enough for a targeted individual, I don’t think it scales: they have to do work that only helps with one user. It’s too “expensive” compared to automated social engineering against a million vulnerable users
The most common way is basically calling up your phone company and pretending to be you saying you needed to switch phones
But also beyond just that the networks that route calls and texts globally are not very secure... and it's not as hard as it should be to get access to it.
its also very inconvenient if you are outside of the country and dont want to pay for roaming. Cellphone providers should offer a way to forward sms messages to an email address, their own webpage or an app.
It is coding for the lowest common denominator of user -- those who use the same easily-guessable password for everything. Making them click a link to login is honestly better security.
Of course there should be an option for those of us who have a TOTP app and use a password manager.
Can't brain today, I have the dumb. What's TOTP, other than that BBC show?
Personally I’m frustrated with always having to give a working phone number to accounts.
I have no idea if I’ve been at all successful in poisoning my data but all my accounts use unique generated emails in addition to generated passwords and fake profile info. It’s just habit now.
However all too often the one piece of real data I have to give is my phone number, and that would be really useful to cross-link all my accounts for data brokers building a dossier on me.
I have hundreds of fake emails but can create at most a couple phone numbers
Same situation for me. I'm hoping a forward thinking cell provider can develop something to combat this. I guess dummy phone numbers wouldn't work, at least not in large cities since they already run out of phone numbers and have to invent new area codes. Maybe provide customers with unlimited extensions?
Outsourcing the securiry risk to a third-party
Yup. "That's not on me! Your email was compromised! That's between your email provider and you!"
I'm paranoid so I view passkeys and similar streamlined login mechanisms as a way to make it easy for police to access your entire digital life once they unlock your phone.
This is why manufacturers started pushing biometric unlocking so hard. Once someone has access to your person and phone they no longer need PINs or passwords to gain access to everything.
Most phone OSes now have a "lockdown mode" which temporarily disables biometric authentication until you use a PIN to unlock it.
They're offloading authentication to your email provider. It's basically quick and cheap oauth. I think it's because they're trying to avoid being a vector for a data breach.
The irony being that putting all of a user’s eggs in one basket makes things far riskier for the user, and not less.
Because people don't realize how ridiculously insecure SMS and (usually unencrypted) email are.
It's just kids who never had a mentor.
gg ez ease of use feature, which is hilarious because that's exactly where smishing attacks come in. People are actually more willing to give out the OTP than their actual password, so it definitely less secure.
I think this started out as a decently good idea, like sign in with a device type of feature (think QR code from an authenticated device), but then along the way someone just went "screw it" and changed it to an OTP.
Even in 2025 password managers are rare, people still reuse the same 8 character password everywhere, and people fall for low effort scams. So someone thought "if they're gonna be insecure anyway, lets just make it so they never have to use a password and sync it to their phone or email".
My previous bank does this sends an SMS. Extremely insecure & also pointless if a would be thief has my phone (if im stupid enough to use no/easily guessable PIN) or has compromised it.
Is there not an argument that password managers have been around long enough now that anyone reusing logins & easily guessable passwords responsible for their own stupidity? We all know not to leave our doors & windows wide open when we go on vacation.
banks have the most obnoxious, yet the stupidest security measures.
Banks are the web sites most likely to reject a generated password from my password generator
It's been a few years, I dont know if they ever fixed it...
However, at least as of 2022, Wells Fargo (the 4th largest bank), had case insensitive passwords.
If you made your password hUnTer2, you could also log in with HUNTER2, hunter2, HUntEr2, etc.
All I can say is: Take my money!
How stupid of WF.
you underestimate how bad a lot of people are at using technology. something like banking can be a necessity and must be accessible to all. many banks should encourage more secure MFA but i understand why they can't require it.
I hate the SMS ones, because I don't have a good phone signal in my home, so I have to ruin around trying to get a couple of bars so I can get the effing code. My banking app just uses a fingerprint.
Check out if your router and provider supports SIP. It allows sms and calls over your wifi connection
No, is the answer. Moving to another ISP when my plan runs out. I'm paying extra for a VoIP line and want to move to WiFi calling.
i have no proof, but im semi sure that this way you cannot sign up with a temp mail or temp sms, so you are kinda forced to use your real data, which means the site is selling your data
It's an immediate red flag for me.
Can't be liable for theft if there were no locks?
well, in case of sending an email with a temporary access code it's not different than using the "forgot password" link
From my experience things like this are not important services. they are things where I keep the password in an online password service which I won't do for anything important.
Which services? I haven't stumbled upon a single one
Too many big password breaches also occurred to me.
But that's what MFA is there for, although they shouldn't be using SMS as one of the possible factors - let alone the main one, as seems to be the case.