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For me it was Call of Duty Black Ops 7 my friend beat it and gave me the disc for my PS5 since he is someone who plays them for a few months and moves on to another game.
That ability to freely give away or resell a game you bought is magical and has been a part of gaming on consoles since the beginning. Now, that's being taken away and I don't agree with it.
And you booted it up and played it straight away? No installation, no updates?
I'm not arguing against a resale/borrowing market, but that doesn't need to have anything to do with physical media.
I thinj you could the campaign but because Call of Duty games still require insane amounts of updates for multiplayer and that was what I was playing no.
However, I have a lot of games that I can run straight away off the discs those are always single player games though.
Doesn't change that you can't resell or trade digital though even DRM free. Disc was the only way to do that despite updates or whatever else it was transferable and yes that has everything to do with physical media.
On PlayStation's blog post that they since deleted but can be viewed in the archives many people said the same thing "ok then, can we sell or trade our digital games now?" The answer will be no, of course because that's what this is all about conquering.
Thing is, both Microsoft and Sony had this exact infrastructure built ready to go for Xbox One and PS4 prior to launch.
We were going to get full digital collections with a marketplace that would allow entitlement sales AND the ability to loan entitlements to friends for set periods of time.
When Microsoft announced the plans at E3 2013, a whiny minority of "core gamers" kicked up such a fuss that Microsofts stock tanked and they backpedalled... Sony hadn't made any announcements yet and presented the EXACT opposite of Microsoft's plan literally 8 hours later despite the fact that their existing hardware DevKits and system software functioned exactly as Microsoft had described. Sony got to look like the "hero" while both of them then scrambled to completely reengineer their hardware and system software prior to launch...
There is an opportunity to work with these companies toward defining what consumers actually want, but as long as the response they get is this petulant luddite outrage of "physical media or death" what is their motivation?
You can't make yourself unreasonable then expect people to reason with you.
Also, those launch discs might be playable, but you know as well as I do that it's the absolute smallest and worst version of the game. Software IS a service now, and that's fucking great because it means the thing you pay for once gets better better over time. You don't get that with any other consumer product.
I thought this was a scheme where you sell it back to Microsoft and they give you a few cents back on it, NOT where you could trade games between other players and that was why it wasn't received well.
It is not unreasonable to want to own or resell a game I buy I understand that can't be done on digital only PC storefronts but when the only other option is to buy digital on PC or PlayStation of you have both someone would be crazy to buy it on the one where they have to pay an ongoing subscription (that just increased!) To play it online.
Every single single player game I've gotten in the last 5 years have been on discs (for playstation) because I could sell it after I beat it and I was able to do that on Facebook marketplace for no fees and everyone was happy with the price. Now that that is being taken away I will just let my PlayStation collect dust and stop updating it until a jailbreak is available for it so I can copy the game files and actually own them.
I have bought every PlayStation since PS1 and have slowly watched them turn themselves into an anti consumer brand that values the C Suite and shareholders over what players actually want.
They "used metrics Sony Financial Reports
in a misleading way that heavily favors digital dominance. By calculating the digital ratio using total full-game software units—which naturally clumps digital-only indie titles, free-to-play titles, and older games with no active physical printing together with new AAA releases—the resulting percentages look overwhelmingly digital.
That right there, is the opposite of how Sony used to be.
Also no, because the game on disc has the ability to be updated and then it runs just exactly like any other game for the system. This can be a problem when they shut down their servers in 20 years but by that time a jailbreak will be ready to rock and I can update it anyway without their servers just like I do for PS4 and PS3 already.
The entire point, is that you get a game that runs the exact same as a digital download but you can sell it. I've basically gotten every single player game for 20-30% off by selling the one I finished before on Facebook marketplace (or if I feel like being robbed of its fair value I could take it to GameStop) and now that will not exist and since its the choice between a shitty digital store that literally JUST TOOK AWAY PEOPLES LEGAL PURCHASES (stole) vs the one that let's you download games you bought from their servers even after the publishers don't sell them anymore then its a very easy choice to never fuck with PlayStation ever again.
The only way I can see this working is if they let you trade games to other players in a public like marketplace not where they offer to give you $2 back when you revoke the license back to them like Xbox was trying to do.
This absolutely CAN be done, and again, MS and Sony built the infrastructure to support it. Steam could as well.
Again, you NEVER owned the game, period. Every single game you have ever purchased (even cartridge ones) came with an EULA explicitly stating that the game itself was "licensed, not sold", and that the studio/publisher had no legal duty to provide access for any specific period of time. You can go look at the games on your shelf RIGHT NOW and confirm this.
Do you have any source for this claim? Because I worked with the products during this timeframe and this is contrary to my understanding and every piece of NDA'd documentation I read.
Ok so I feel like I have to explain this, I am aware that when you buy something you don't own the rights to the intellectual property itself.
If I buy a Clive Barker book I don't get to print it out and sell a million copies, but I can sell that ONE copy that I bought.
The movie thing works like this, I bought it on PlayStation digitally= PlayStation took it away and fucked me.
I buy the DVD from Warner Bros or whatever Sony is involved in and 10 years later when they remove it from stores guess what? I can still watch it or resell it.
Both are licenses even the discs but one can't be taken away from me and be resold and one can be taken away from me and not ever be resold
You're right. I CAN look at my games right now and verify. Know why? Because they're on my shelf. I can't verify that with Jericho on the ps3 that I legally bought digitally with a visa giftcard I got from Christmas one year. Know why? Because sony took that ability to download that away from me. My buddy has a disc that still works though.
I feel like you're intentionally not trying to understand the difference here.
Also yes here's the article about what Microsoft ACTUALLY tried to do, they NEVER tried to do a player to player marketplace. It was all heavily restricted and only certain retailers were allowed. Know why people didn't like it? BECAUSE YOU COULD ALREADY SELL PHYSICAL ANYWHERE THEY WERE TRYING TO CHANGE THAT into a closed ecosystem that they controlled with a few third parties that they also called the shots for. So really, it was a testament to physical games being better than digital even then.
https://www.wired.com/2013/06/xbox-one-used-games/
Also when I say "can't be done" I men's that it isn't allowed at any of them and so therefore cannot be done. Sure the technology exists for it I never said it didn't I said, that it cannot be done. Can you show me a PC storefront where it can be done.
Kind if like when PlayStation shuts down the ps3 store and online services next month, downloading a game on ps3 from PlayStation store "can't be done" anymore. Doesn't mean the technology to do so never existed or even wasn't implemented (in PC storefronts it never was implemented though) just means that the option doesn't exist anymore and so it
Can't. Be. Done.
You are being purposefully obtuse about the entire conversation. Sure if companies decided they wanted to be pro consumer tomorrow it could be done but they will not do that. That's why I said that the only way this will work without PlayStation dying in the next 10 years is if they allow you to do that. As of right now, it can't be done.
I FULLY understand that you don't like this; that does not make it morally objectionable or illegal.
Did you read the terms of service when you signed up for the digital movie service?
Did you read the terms of sale when you purchased that digital movie?
Did both of those things tell you very clearly in plain english that the owners of the service reserved the right to remove content at their discretion and provided no assurance of ongoing perpetual access?
Did you complete the purchase anyway?
How is this anything but a YOU problem?
Yes I an very aware of all the terms of service it comes with.
Know what I did after watching or playing it? Sold the disc.
My country gives me the legal right to do so. So all the licensing and shit doesn't mean I couldn't resell a game disc or DVD/blu ray after I got finished with it.
I know a disc is a license. Thing is, that movie Sony took away? Those games Sony delisted? All of them still work on disc, license or not. All of them can be resold or traded, license or not.
What part of this is untrue?
That the thing, if you buy it digital they CAN swing their dick around and take it from you. If I buy it on disc it will work until the disc rots or if its an online only game when the servers get shut down but I don't buy games like that physically anyway games like that it wouldn't matter if its on disc or not.
That's why people are mad. You just said it. They can use their legal mumbo jumbo shit to forcefully take it from you on digital only storefronts minus Gog where I can back up the offline installers (still can't resell them though legally so that's still different)
They couldn't do this on disc copies.
I noticed in another comment you said you worked with game companies before? It seems like you have a reason to force yourself to not understand this on purpose. So let me make it easy.
Disc= I can resell or trade it even if they unlist it from the digital store. Its a license on a disc.
Digital only= unless I can phsyically back up the game files somehow once they delist it I am fucked and will never be able to play it again. Its a license that can be taken away at a whim whenever the company decides.
Also where did I ever say that was illegal? I said it was anti consumer and it very much is. In my opinion that's immoral to be anti consumer but that's just opinion.
The ability to sell and trade discs isn't an opinion. Its an objective fact. At least, in my country.
Yeah, it's where you start acting like the fact that discs HAVE existed means you should always be entitled to that.
Game companies don't want to make discs anymore, they don't need a fucking reason, its THEIR ART.
If that's a deal breaker for you then find a new hobby.
The problem is that instead of being an adult presenting your opinion as "this thing I like is changing or going away. I have to stop engaging with the thing I like because of my opinions/preference/ethics and that is sad." you are presenting it as an objective moral argument; that is what I am arguing with.
I hate that some of my favorite movies only exist because the involvement of horrible sex criminals. It's sad that I can't enjoy those things anymore because of my opinions/preferences/ethics, but I am not suggesting or demanding that those movies should be taken away from everyone on earth because of how I feel.
So you don't want the movies people have bought to be taken away from every one on earth who bought them but you do want that with video games?
Is that right?
Nah, greedy fucks bleeding everyone dry gets to be called out with the same malice they use when the company does it. Fuck that greedy shit.
Steam still let's my friend download Jericho that HE bought even though they have it unlisted and the publisher stopped selling it.
Guess what PlayStation did? Said FUCK YOU and took away the ability to download something I bought.
Is steam wrong for being pro consumer or is Sony right for being anti consumer?
Publisher and devs both got paid with both purchases. PlayStation and steam both got 30% of that. So why is it wrong for steam to let me access it?
This kind of fuckery was the last stand against sonys greedy shit like that. The only way we could still access what we bought because Sony is too much of an anti consumer company to still let us download it unlike steam.
Steam and PlayStation alone get to decide if you can still download it or not once the game gets delisted. Now they can't sell it again once its delisted but taking away my ability to download it again is anti consumer and that's why if forced to a digital only storefront I'm going with the one that still let's me play my game licenses I paid for vs the shitty one that likes to be dicks.
That is majority opinion of gamers right now.
Are you suggesting that Steam shouldn't be allowed to let me download what I bought again even if it gets delisted? Does it get to decide or is that only PlayStation you let make choices on behalf of the consumer?
There are 3,700,000,000 people who regularly play video games. The majority of them don't even speak or read english... they certainly don't care what you or Gamesradar have to say about the "purity" of the video game industry. Your attitude is gatekeeping and nothing more.
You agreed to all the terms you lament when you clicked "Buy". If you didn't read them thats on you.
I agreed when I bought a disc that I could resell. I agree when I buy on steam because I know I'll always get to download the game still (at least until Gabe dies and the console people get their greedy paws all over the company)
More people game on steam than any other digital store. You know, the one who still let's you download the games you purchased no matter what. So by that logic majority HAVE chosen.
And let's see PlayStation's numbers in 5 years after they make this decision. I bet you'll see a lot more people making their choice.
When you buy it on PlayStation or Xbox they say "fuck you and that money you paid us the publisher delisted it so instead of letting you still play it we delisted it to" it isn't the piblishers or Devs that choose this anti consumer practice, or else steam wouldn't be able to do the right thing and let you still download the license you bought.
You attitude of "they SHOULD be allowed to take it away later" is gatekeeping for the very console companies you've done work with.
Majority of gamers chose the storefront that doesn't take shit away. Or are you going back on that majority thing now that you know this? Obviously if you get banned then yes but cool thing is if I have it downloaded already I can easily still play my steam games with a very simple crack.
Short of getting banned, every purchase I have made on steam for the last 13 years is still available to download even games they don't make anymore my buddy has Jericho but I have escape from Boneville. Still rocking on steam and able to be downloaded because they aren't a greedy company of suits that doesn't give a fuck about their consumers.
Console is already getting their lunch eaten by mobile... People don't give a shit.
Also, Steam will go away one day. And your blu-rays won't work in 20-30 years either...
Art is ephemeral, that's what makes it beautiful.
Steam will go away long after PlayStation or Xbox will and I'll likely be dead by then.
And actually, my discs WILL still work because I rip them and save the contents because I'm not letting some shitty company take my shit away.
I have had a few discs degrade that I had to get rid same with books but I just downloaded a pirated copy of both with absolutely ZERO remorse because I already bought the media once. I should be allowed to access it privately for 80 years because I paid for it.
Steam is the only store that let's this still happen. You are right that steam will change soon (Gabe dies) but even the smoldering ashes of the largest video game storefront in the world will outlast PlayStation and Xbox by miles.
By your logic DaVinci and Picasso should have burned all their art before passing. They expired after all so the license to view their work should too! Art being ephemeral and all that.
What you described is some corporate fuckery the C Suite wants you to equate to art.
"You will own nothing and be happy"
I can buy prints of Picasso and Escher right now online and they will get shipped to my house and be mine forever. I don't own the art, I own a copy. But its mine. I can trade it, sell it, burn it, I can even roll it up and shove it wayyyyyy wayyyyyy up my ass if I wanted to. Because I paid for it and its my copy.
Should be the same for all art.
Also mobile beating console is funny you're right that more people play bejeweled and shit like that on their phones that own PlayStation's or gaming PCs but remind me out of all the AAA games that have released in the last 10 years how many of those made it to mobile?
You big delulu bro...
You're so culturally illiterate you can't see past your western European garden wall to the broader world around you.
I noticed you didn't have an answer to burning Picasso's or other artists work after they die.
Why?
Someone bought it from them but should that have given them the right to hang it on their wall until they die? They didn't paint it. Picasso can't make money off of it anymore.
Should that purchase have been taken away on expiration of the creator?
Being called culturally illiterate by you is hilarious by the way. You who can't seem to understand why all the communities you access online disagree vehemently with your anti consumer bs.
You are the Simpsons meme of "no, it isn't me its the others that are wrong"
There would be absolutely nothing wrong with Picasso or DaVinci burning their works, and MANY artists throughout history have done just that. Look at Banksy's "Love is in the Bin" for a modern take. I really don't care what other people do with their art, its none of my business; this seems to be the core issue most of you are struggling with.
I have no expectation of finding like minds in online gaming communities for exactly the reasons of proportionality I have already stated. Gaming media, and gaming social media is a poor approximation of the opinions of the majority of gamers, as they don't engage in either.
I am here explicitly to engage with fundamentalism as its a good reminder of how rigid and irrational people can get when they let their emotions dictate their opinions and actions. See you are emotionally invested in the outcome of this physical media issue. I literally do not care what happens. In some ways, the public (albeit minority) discourse around this issue is performative, and arguably functions as an extension of entire video game art ecosystem; we are both taking part in a collaborative performance right now.
That's not what I asked. I asked you if the works they sold to others during their lifetimes should have been burned when they died. They are the original IP creators/holders. That's very different from the artist themselves doing it, it is having another party let's say the art fair where Picasso or whoever originally sold the artwork. When Picasso dies that market comes in and burns the work you bought. You support that?
If your answer is yes, then you're even more out of touch for calling me culturally illiterate. Video Games and books and movies and all art is influenced by other artworks and artists from the past and present.
Only someone who is truly culturally illiterate couldn't make sense of that truth.
Even if you don't care what happens with the phsycial medium if you are a gamer on PlayStation you will be affected by this outcome as it promotes anti consumer ideology at it's core and when they see that this will work (for the ones who stay and accept this bs) more anti consumer practices will follow and you will be affected.
And if you don't game on PlayStation, then wtf does your opinion matter on this it doesn't even affect you at all.
Are you under the impression that Sony wants to come into your house and destroy all you old discs?
This example is still a false equivalency, no matter how many times you and others use it...when you purchase a digital license for a piece of software, you are not buying the canvas. You are buying a ticket to an exhibition.
That exhibition requires electricity, security, and ongoing staff labor to keep the building open. When the gallery can no longer afford the operating costs to pay that staff, they close the doors. They aren't "burning" the art, the event is simply over. You are throwing a philosophical tantrum because you think your one-time ticket purchase means the gallery is legally obligated to stay open and pay its workers to maintain the exhibit for the rest of your life.
To your other point, I own every game console every created, from the Magnavox Odyssey to the PS5 Pro. I use all of them at various points, and engage with mobile and web-based gaming. I've been doing this for a LONG time and there are HUNDREDS of games I have played, adored, and will never be able to experience again and that is not only perfectly acceptable, it is beautiful.
Art. Is. Ephemeral.
Nope. I know this is hard for you to understand but I am suggesting that if someone sells their artwork, and you buy it, you should be allowed to own THAT COPY (yeah yeah its a licesnse you can make an entire paragraph about that again if you want to) FOREVER.
You said yourself that you think its ok if companies take a copy of something you have bought away from you and that is why you are unable to understand what everyone else is saying.
In this scenario, it is the same as buying a painting only to have someone come in and destroy it later. SONY ALREADY DOES THIS WITH GAMES AND MOVIES. You can look that up.
So no your willful misunderstanding of what I am saying is wrong. They will destroy copies of your DIGITAL GAMES going forward when they no longer offer the option of physical discs.
They have done this before, so what is so hard for you to accept and understand about them doing it again?
You WANT to get fucked. You want to have the media you consumed on a subscription based model that you never own. You said yourself you're ok with that.
And that's why no one respects your opinion on this. I've seen some of the other threads, you can take the "yes daddy fuck meplease" route with gaming and media in general if you want but don't be upset when a loud majority of people are very vocal about that being bullshit and bad for gaming in general. Because it is.
I have never once in my life had the expectation that any digital entitlement I have purchased would be usable for the rest of my life.
Not only would that be an insane, illogical, and entitled perspective to hold; but it is also directly contradicted by every TOS/EULA of every single streaming service I have ever signed up for, and the T&C of every single digital purchase I have ever completed.
I am at a loss as to why you, or anyone else has ever had a different expectation.
Have you never actually read anything you've agreed to?
RTFM indeed...
With steam I don't lose my digital license purchases.
I do with PlayStation.
Discs used to be the way that couldn't happen.
Now they are taking that choice away, and have a proven track record of taking digital shit back.
Unlike steam. And unlike they weren't able to do on disc games.
That is why people are pissed.
That is also part of the reason more people use steam, because they make pro consumer choices just like that.
It isn't publishers and devs that want to take the copy you bought away from you, or steam couldn't do it. Its PlayStation's greedy ass that does it. Publishers and deva only make it not sellable anymore because of licensing.
I made it so simple my child can understand every point I made so I'll be really impressed if you don't get it this time.
I have never once in my life had the expectation that any digital entitlement I have purchased would be usable for the rest of my life.
Not only would that be an insane, illogical, and entitled perspective to hold; but it is also directly contradicted by every TOS/EULA of every single streaming service I have ever signed up for, and the T&C of every single digital purchase I have ever completed.
I am at a loss as to why you, or anyone else has ever had a different expectation.
I have always expected to lose ALL OF MY DIGITAL ENTITLEMENTS AT SOME POINT IN THE FUTURE.
Have you never actually read anything you’ve agreed to?
I already replied to that same ai response copied word for word like you just posted.
You are replying to the comment of me answering what you just said.
Lol.
Yes... Intentionally because you ignored my point and added nothing new...
Try and keep up.
Lol try and keep up with you repeating ai slop and not saying anything new in the comment?
Nice cover though.
Also go fuck you calling me culturally illiterate and shit when you say you want companies to take things back you buy but then also whine about microplartics. If you weren't the anti consumer pos you are working for those people none of it would be a problem.
You're an arrogant asshole that I have yet to see a single person on here agree with.
Maybe the ai can help you figure out a reply?
I don't care if people agree with me, I'm not here for consensus and I certainly don't need to prove anything to you. You're the one with a chip on your shoulder lashing out emotionally.
I have zero emotional connection to this issue. I don't need to feel correct, because I have demonstrated the logic and rationalism behind my view. Your only recourse is to name call, and attempt to disregard conflicting perspectives as artificial or paid because you have no objective observation or historical precedent, nor any rational or philosophical underpinning to your position. You're frustrated because you know your arguments have no merit, and you're not even particularly effective at articulating your irrational emotional response.
Whether you pull your shit together for a serious intellectual debate, continue your diatribe, or disappear entirely; the industry is still going to do what they want, you are still going to lose, and the entire industry will be better for it.
You called me delusional among other things so shove it up your ass.
Now that that's out of the way you are anti consumer and no one here gives a fuck what you think as evidenced by the countless people telling you to fuck off and your inability to form responses without ai copy and paste as evidenced by your other comments.
The companies you have said you worked for do though so continue to be a part of that and everyone will move to steam where they get to actually always download what they buy. If you really gave a fuck about microplastics you'd do the same because that's the only way to be PRO consumer with digital only purchases.
Keep licking the boots baby. I don't care about you or your corporate shill opinions. Do you have all this free time to be on here because you were one of the ones recently laid off? Sure sucks to be part of a shit company eh?
You didn't find your echo chamber anti consumer mentality on reddit and you won't find it here either. Continue to be culturally illiterate bud.
If you truly thought my opinion was unrealistic, out of line, or paid, you would have moved right past it like the hundreds of true believers here.
You only engaged because it pissed you off that you couldn't easily dismiss my points in your own head and the cognitive dissonance caused pain as you approached a meaningful thought.
You never proved anything I said wrong. In fact you conceded and said "yeah well I think its OK that they can take stuff back they should be able to do that!"
I'm calling that bs out because employees like you spread that shit online to try and gain positive sentiment about your anti consumer crap. And I'll make damn sure anyone reading that gets to see the other perspective in the same thread.
Fuck anti consumer bullshit and fuck the employees of these companies that support it, like you.
Nobody cares bro. AT LEAST Half of those 3,700,000,000 gamers have NEVER owned a piece of physical gaming media in their life...
You're like some boomer "audiophile" defending vinyl... You've lost some important neuroplasticity.