this post was submitted on 10 Jul 2025
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A robot trained on videos of surgeries performed a lengthy phase of a gallbladder removal without human help. The robot operated for the first time on a lifelike patient, and during the operation, responded to and learned from voice commands from the team—like a novice surgeon working with a mentor.

The robot performed unflappably across trials and with the expertise of a skilled human surgeon, even during unexpected scenarios typical in real life medical emergencies.

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[–] DrunkenPirate@feddit.org 111 points 2 days ago (5 children)

And then you‘re lying on the table. Unfortunately, your case is a little different than the standard surgery. Good luck.

[–] echodot@feddit.uk 1 points 5 hours ago

I assume my insides are pretty much like everyone else's. I feel like if there was that much of a complication it would have been pretty obvious before the procedure started.

"Hey this guy had two heads, I'm sure the AI will work it out."

[–] Buffalox@lemmy.world 52 points 2 days ago (5 children)

At some point in a not very distant future, you will probably be better off with the robot/AI. As it will have wider knowledge of how to handle fringe cases than a human surgeon.
We are not there yet, but maybe in 10 years or maybe 20?

[–] balder1991@lemmy.world 3 points 14 hours ago

Or the most common cases can be automated while the more nuanced surgeries will take the actual doctors.

[–] nyan@lemmy.cafe 34 points 2 days ago (3 children)

I'd bet on at least twenty years before it's in general use, since this is a radical change and it makes sense to be cautious about new technology in medicine. Initial clinical trials for some common, simple surgeries within ten years, though.

This is one of those cases where an algorithm carefully trained on only relevant data can have value. It isn't the same as feeding an LLM the unfiltered Internet and then expecting it to learn only from the non-crazy parts.

[–] echodot@feddit.uk 1 points 5 hours ago

The idea that a carefully curated data set may yield better results seems to be something that even the likes of Google engineers can't get their heads around.

[–] curbstickle@lemmy.dbzer0.com 9 points 1 day ago

This is one of those cases where an algorithm carefully trained on only relevant data can have value.

Hopefully more people learn that this is the important part.

It becomes nonsense when you just feed it everything and the kitchen sink. A well trained model works.

[–] yardratianSoma@lemmy.ca 7 points 2 days ago (1 children)

it'll definitely get the greenlight in countries like China before anywhere in the west, I believe

[–] brendansimms@lemmy.world 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)
[–] yardratianSoma@lemmy.ca 6 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Just a hunch, since technological advancements seem to hit the public realm much faster in places like China, in the cities especially. I don't know what the laws are like there, but I've heard rumors that there is less government regulations for technologies that can benefit the general public, like drones and automated metros. Oh yeah, and how could I forget about the robots they show off at conventions, to take the place of receptionists and other customer-facing positions.

[–] echodot@feddit.uk 1 points 5 hours ago (1 children)

There's always a Japanese company showing off mechs at those conventions as well. We never see them in general usage though.

[–] DrunkenPirate@feddit.org 1 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

I work with of those shiny tech companies from China. Believe me the shiny part is on the surface only. The more you look under the hood, the more it’s getting poor. With Chinese tech the problems start when you have it. European companies before you have it. US companies when you have no scale.

Regarding Chinese regulations, you simply drill it down to: for the Government a human live is not worth much. Because „we are so many“

The main issue with any computer is that they can't adapt to new situations. We can infer and work through new problems. The more variables the more "new" problems. The problem with biology is there isn't really any hard set rules, there are almost always exceptions. The amount of functional memory and computing power is ridiculous for a computer. Driving works mostly because there are straightforward rules.

[–] DrunkenPirate@feddit.org 2 points 1 day ago

I doubt it. It simply would be enough, if the AI could understand and say when it reaches its limits and hand over to a human. But that is even hard for humans as Dunning & Kruger discovered.

[–] SheeEttin@lemmy.zip 0 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Fringe cases yes, like rare conditions. It almost certainly won't be able to handle something completely unexpected.

[–] Buffalox@lemmy.world -2 points 1 day ago (2 children)

The AI will (probably) be familiar with every possible issue that no human will be able to match.
I'm not sure what kind of "completely unexpected" situation is possible can happen, that a normal surgeon would handle better?
But I agree it would have to be a lot smarter than current LLM and self driving for instance. Like a whole other level of smarter. But I think that is where we are heading.

[–] watty@piefed.social 2 points 20 hours ago

I think you make a mistake of thinking that our collective body of knowledge is exhaustive. We discover new things all the time. Until we know everything (i.e. never), there will be gaps that AI will not be able to accommodate.

[–] SheeEttin@lemmy.zip 5 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Would it be able to handle a sudden power outage? A fire alarm going off?

[–] kautau@lemmy.world 4 points 1 day ago

What happens to an ecmo machine during a power outage or fire alarm?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extracorporeal_membrane_oxygenation

The idea should be to augment healthcare professionals with tools they can use. The hospital will need to have contingencies in place. I agree if that your point is that we can’t replace people with machines. But we can increase effectiveness with them.

[–] Buffalox@lemmy.world -1 points 1 day ago

As well as a human, and without fucking up because of stress.
Also my guess is these would be monitored by trained professionals.

[–] otacon239@lemmy.world 31 points 2 days ago (2 children)

realistic surgery

lifelike patient

I wonder how doctors could compare this simulation to a real surgery. I’m willing to bet it’s “realistic and lifelike” in the way a 4D movie is.

Biological creatures don’t follow perfect patterns you have all sorts of unexpected things happen. I was just reading an article about someone whose entire organs are mirrored from the average person.

Nothing about humans is “standard”.

[–] alleycat@feddit.org 13 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I wonder how doctors could compare this simulation to a real surgery. I’m willing to bet it’s “realistic and lifelike” in the way a 4D movie is.

I think "lifelike" in this context means a dead human. The robot was originally trained on pigs.

[–] CrazyLikeGollum@lemmy.world 1 points 13 hours ago

The article mentions that previously they used pig cadavers with dyes and specially marked tissues to guide the robot. While it doesn't specify exactly what the "lifelike patient" is, to me the article reads like they're still using a pig cadaver just without those aids.

[–] Zexks@lemmy.world 6 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Right I'm sure a bunch of arm chair docs on lemme are totally more knowledgeable and have more understanding of all this and their needed procedures than actual licensed doctors.

[–] skulblaka@sh.itjust.works -1 points 1 day ago

More than the doctors? No, absolutely not.

More than the bean counters who want to replace these doctors with unsupervised robots? I'm a lot more confident on that one.

[–] HubertManne@piefed.social 7 points 2 days ago

and since its been the way its been for awhile sugeons know more theoretically how to do surgery rather than practically so can't really take over.

[–] Tattorack@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

What if I'm on the table telling the truth?

[–] DrunkenPirate@feddit.org 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

That’s a different thing indeed. In your case the AI 🤖 goes wild, will strip dance and tell poor jokes (while flirting with the ventilation machine)