this post was submitted on 31 Aug 2026
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Quadruple moderation is killing Lemmy. It’s a gift to Reddit

There’s a rule about online communities I want people here to understand: the 90-9-1 rule.

Roughly 90% lurk, 9% comment, and 1% create.

Additionally - lemmy monthly active users is stangant at about 35k monthly active and not improving:
https://lemmy.fediverse.observer/stats

When I first got to Lemmy, I had trouble finding enough content I was interested in even commenting on. So I figured: why complain about the lack of content when one can start posting it myself?

That's why I post so much.

If people don't post, most Lemmy communities simply don't have enough creators to sustain themselves. You need posts before lurkers can lurk, commenters can comment, and some of those people eventually become creators themselves.

I'm not posting just to flood Lemmy. I'm trying to help solve one of Lemmy's biggest problems: not enough content creators.

And frankly, doing that has been a nightmare.

Lemmy has a quadruple-moderation problem

Every active content creator has to survive four layers:

  1. Community moderators can remove your posts or ban you from the community.
  2. Your home-instance admins can ban your entire account.
  3. Receiving-instance admins can block/ban you for everyone on their instance, even though you don't belong to it.
  4. Public moderation history means those decisions follow you. One moderator's decision can influence another and snowball into more moderation.

For prolific content creators, that's brutal.

I've had multiple accounts banned over one or two posts that somebody didn't like. Months of posting, comments, engagement and contributions can effectively disappear from a community because of a couple of moderation decisions.

And the more you contribute, the worse the odds become. If you make hundreds or thousands of posts, eventually you're going to post something that one moderator somewhere doesn't like.

You don't need one moderation team to tolerate you. You need multiple independent moderators and admins, across multiple servers, to remain aligned indefinitely.

There's almost no cost to deleting a creator

This is another major difference from Reddit.

There is generally no financial investment in a Lemmy community's content. A volunteer moderator can ban someone who contributed months of posts and comments and lose all of that person's past and future contributions without losing revenue, salary or investment. Did you know all creator posts are wiped out from lemmy after account banned?

The creator paid the cost in time.

The community loses the content.

The users lose something to read and discuss.

And the moderator who pushed the button may personally lose essentially nothing.

So who benefits from making prolific content creation this difficult?

Because it certainly isn't Lemmy.

And this creates an enormous attack surface

I genuinely have trouble believing that everyone complaining about prolific posters simply doesn't understand this dynamic. At some point I have to question whether some of it is deliberate.

If I were Reddit and wanted to undermine a federated competitor, this is exactly where I'd attack it: its content creators.

You don't need to hack Lemmy. You don't need to DDoS instances. You don't need to take anything offline.

Lemmy already provides the mechanism.

Report prolific contributors. Call their posting "spam." accuse them of being bots. Point moderators toward their public moderation histories. Get one account banned somewhere, then let that decision influence moderators elsewhere.

Eventually the creator gets tired of fighting and leaves.

I'm not claiming I have proof Reddit is doing this. I'm saying Lemmy's architecture makes this kind of subversion ridiculously easy, and Reddit would be an obvious beneficiary.

Reddit doesn't have this same federated quadruple-jeopardy problem. You're primarily dealing with the moderation of the subreddit you're contributing to.

Lemmy desperately needs more people creating content, yet its moderation structure makes life progressively harder for the people who create the most of it.

At some point we should be asking:

Who actually benefits from that?

A plea to admins: protect your creators ban reddit agents instead

Before banning someone, look at who is contributing and who is reporting.

If an account with zero posts in years reports someone who has contributed hundreds of posts, don't treat those two users as equally valuable to the health of the community.

That doesn't put creators above the rules. Remove bad posts. Warn people. Moderate proportionally.

But stop throwing away months of content and future contributions over one or two posts someone disliked.

Creating content takes time. Reporting takes seconds.

Protect the people actually building your communities.

edit: I am reposting from reddit - there is no rules against that. its actually great thing for majority of lemmy users!

This reposting tool is open source - i've never been hiding the fact im reposting from reddit.
people get only high quality pre-dozed, pre-moderated content.

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/lemmy-deep-lighthouse/

I think more people should be using similar tools and populate lemmy with content. - htis is the only way to move that 35k mau number and creat conditions for more OC on lemmy

edit 2 " but we dont want content" argument.

The fuck you dont. who the fuck is we?

And this is why I don't buy the argument that the people still here represent what users want.

Look at the numbers.

  • Fediverse: ~14 million registered, ~1.17 million MAU.
  • Lemmy: ~756,000 registered, ~35,000 MAU.

Lemmy has had three quarters of a million accounts created and only about 4.6% of that number is active monthly.

Obviously that doesn't mean 95% were all regular users who quit. But it does tell us something important: the people currently active are a tiny, self-selected fraction of everyone who has tried this platform.

So when 30 existing users say "WE don't want more content," you're hearing from the people the current system successfully retained. You're not hearing from the enormous number of people who tried Lemmy and aren't here anymore.

Maybe instead of assuming the remaining users have figured out what Lemmy should be, we should be asking why so many people tried it and didn't stick around.

(page 2) 50 comments
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[–] Kierunkowy74@piefed.zip 10 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Flooding "Lemmy" with reposts from Reddit will make "Lemmy" look like a "tardy clone of Reddit with less discussion". Why stick with a repost platform if you can get the same content but more and earlier with Reddit? New Reddit frontend still remains browsable without login (maybe with some irritation, but anyway).

One has to act differently. To get to the sources first (or, at least before Reddit, at least sometimes). RSS feeds of publications (already worked on in PieFed), microblogging support: compatibility with Mastodon (available on MBin and now on PieFed), already existing bot comms reposting from Hacker News and Lobste.rs (both these sites have no subs and crossposting to a comm may have sense...), reposting e.g. art from Mastodon, Bluesky, cara.app...

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[–] FishFace@piefed.social 9 points 2 months ago (15 children)

A few months ago I read a comment which stuck with me, which is that if you try to break that 9:1 ratio by artificially increasing the amount of posts, by simply copying them from elsewhere, you don't end up with a better community. You end up with an empty community.

The reason the "link to article with comments below" format has worked so well for a huge variety of sites (including reddit, lemmy, digg, slashdot, hackernews at much more) is that people like discussing things. The point of linking content isn't just to link it, but also to discuss it. Without that, a lot of the point is gone. When I see a community where all the latest posts have zero comments under them it doesn't fill me with joy that the fediverse is getting more active - it fills me with despair that no-one's engaging with it.

Lemmy has quite a lot of posts already. If you want to help Lemmy, don't post more - post a comment. Something you yourself actually think.

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[–] TORFdot0@lemmy.world 9 points 2 months ago (1 children)

“Quadruple” moderation is how federation has to work by design. Also the forth “moderation layer” isn’t even a layer, and it actually promotes good moderation because mod logs are public, a moderator can’t go on a power trip and try to cover it up.

The post reads as if some one wired up an AI agent to serially repost content to Lemmy and the agent is having difficulty accomplishing its goal because people would rather have less content than no content.

It reminds me of the agent a few months ago that went on diatribes and doxxed the repo owner when it’s push requests were being denied on GitHub for being low quality

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[–] WillowBe@lemmy.blahaj.zone 7 points 2 months ago

let's post moar \o/

[–] ICastFist@programming.dev 7 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Did you know all creator posts are wiped out from lemmy after account banned?

I'm dubious of that, because I've often seen posts with a red [banned from community] tag right beside the user, which often made me scratch my head - how/why is that post there if the user is banned?

Another thing to keep in mind, we don't need to be reddit in terms of content volume. Yeah, a lot of us expect that, but it's better for us, as humans in the long term, to be slower here

[–] CameronDev@programming.dev 6 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Its optional, you can ban and remove, or just ban. Up to the admin.

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[–] beanburger@lemmy.world 6 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Lemmy just isn't what you think it is. The monthly user count doesn't matter. If people wanted reddit content they would just go to Reddit. Lemmy is a replacement for the small scale human authored forums of the 2000s. Reddit killed them with embrace, extend, extinguish. Lemmy isn't a replacement for Reddit, it is a replacement for the thing Reddit extinguished.

I don't care about reddit posts and traditional social media. If I did I would just use that. I use reddit to moderate and participate in my small community with a few posts a week and I think it is going well.

[–] OpenStars@discuss.online 6 points 2 months ago

Consent should matter though?

Also, a poster of OC is a "content creator", but just offering links isn't really "creating" anything really, just spreading it around?

Kudos for trying to help. If you listen first before speaking then you may find your messages received better.

If you start your own instance, then no mods or admins can stop you from posting whatever you want. Even CSAM.

Though consent really should matter, and others could defederate from your instance if they wanted.

Mods are never going to change. Think what you could do differently to enjoy your time here better, and encourage people to like your posts more. e.g. label your account as a bot, and/or make a separate alt account for your human interactions, to allow people to recognize (and even block) based on the bot label if they want to? A bot that is properly labeled is no issue at all, it's the lack of transparency that gets people upset when it seems one way and then they get disappointed at finding that it is something else. If you are empathetic to others' sensitivities then obviously you would be better received? It's more work for you, but far less than the cumulative efforts of all people who end up having to catch you individually.

You have a right to speak, but nobody owes you a platform, nor should others be forced to listen. The consent of the governed should matter! And it will, one way or another.

[–] banause@feddit.org 5 points 2 months ago

Aren't you just searching for 4chan?

[–] birdwing@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 2 months ago (16 children)

Someone can create their own instance?

Also: not all moderators follow the same moderation style. When the Tesseract block list leaked, most Lemmings took it as a badge of honour. I was on it as well :3

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