Aww man, China is dumping to gain market share for EVs? That's crazy. If only car manufacturers had adapted to EVs sooner and researched more into better battery technologies, they might not be in this position. Get fucked. This whole, every car has to be super luxorious in America is getting ridiculous. I looked at a rav4 last year and the "features" they included in the base model was mental. I just want my car to go when I press the pedal. Brake. And a CD Player. I don't need half the shit they put in American market cars. Doesn't help that I have a large family that needs to travel far, frequently. So, my hands are tied with getting an SUV. I'd kill for a better train transit in America. Next car gets to be an EV though. Cause that's the sedan.
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I've been wanting Honda to make an affordable all-electric car for years. Based on how BYD is selling, I'm guessing I'm not the only one.
Instead they keep making bigger and bigger, gas-guzzling vehicles, with bells and whistles we don't need, saying that's what sells and they can't make an electric vehicle they're happy with.
Well, too bad. It seems I've bought my last Honda, sadly, because my next vehicle will not burn gasoline.
"Detroit Motor City". I.e subsidizing losses.
Of course you could apply protectionism, but that wouldn't be fair and would set a public precedent on the global markets.
But yeah, the petroleum lobby really managed to screw us sideways. All those anti EV, anti solar and anti wind campaigns.
It is perhaps the biggest, oldest, slowest moving and most fraudulent of bailouts in all of history.
We are just that stupid.
This continues to baffle me. Europe, the US, and likely even Japan was never going to be able to win the race to the bottom on price. China understands its supply chain and mineral strengths and has optimized its entire production towards churning out good (or good enough) EVs at scale.
Still, the US could continue to wall China out of its market with massive tariffs while also promoting alternative cheaper vehicle options, a large portion of which should and could be EVs. But the US hasn't even done that... Domestic manufacturers have run screaming from EVs, seemingly ceding the entire field to China.
But the US hasn't even done that...
And continues to stubbornly refuse to.
This is a repeat of the '70s when fuel prices shot up, and people started buying fuel efficient Japanese cars.
The American manufacturers just continued making their land yachts and muscle cars until they came up with such innovations as the Ford Pinto or the AMC Gremlin...
And even those weren't as fuel efficient as the average Toyota or Honda or Datsun of the era.
Ford, GM and Stelantis are going to just keep pumping out SUVs as fast as they can with only the occational token EV that doesn't meet what the market demands.
Mustang drivers or pickup truck drivers aren't the ones most actively seeking an EV.
They need to come up with an EV that competes with a Corolla. Or one that is in the same ballpark as the BYD cars. Not on price alone - no North America based manufacturer can compete directly on price against a subsidizd Chinese company, but on the being a car part.
Good morning. You old style car companies (and it is not just the US ones, count the European companies in, too) slept through the last decades. They tried everything in the book to supress EVs, and still keep developing fossil fuel cars to be released in ten years.
And now they start to wake up, seeing that the world moved onwithout them, and they cry.
While Toyota and Honda at least have an acclaimed history in low cost and efficient vehicles, Ford is literally 1/3rd the the reason the US doesn't manufacture sedans anymore, with the other 2/3rds being GM and Chrysler.
I actually witnesses them layoff their entire sedan division in real time when they announced the end of the fusion. I'm pretty sure it was mostly liquidated by the time covid hit.
Because trucks are made with safety loopholes and have higher profit margins, and Ford shit the bed with the Fusion, Festiva and Focus with a garbage transmission they knowingly sold for 7 years.
Got to used to not having to compete
I just rented a car while on vacation and they gave me a perfectly fine Nissan Qashqai, except there was a problem with the car so I could not use it. The rental agency only had one car left, a BYD Seal hybrid.
What a fun car to drive. Had a lot of power, great handling, cameras and sensors everywhere for navigating tight spots, and since I was driving on the wrong side of the road, those came in handy.
I am sure that driving a brand new RAV-4 would be a similar experience, but after I was done with that car I searched its price range and competition, and the #1 car was in fact the Toyota Rav 4, and the comparison had that car out ahead due to resale value and initial quality, with the BYD Seal leading on price point, standard features, and battery range (which was significantly higher) among other categories.
I have a feeling that resale value and initial quality might be a shifting category, as well. Really impressed by that car.
But I thought super capitalism would allow markets to self regulate, motivate competition, and weed out low performer. Isn't that a good thing anymore?
Also, I'm laughing at "unless things change, we will not survive". That might be the change happening, buddy.
ok
I'm curious what exactly this means. . . Are they taking raw materials in one door and finished cars out the other? Because that seems unlikely, would be impressive tho.
I've been in the market for a decent Japanese EV for like 10 years now and still drive my 2004 toyota around. Sure China is dumping but Japan has been sleeping so hard it's hard to have any sympathy here.
Lmfao at the pro capitalism crybabies in this thread
- Free market is superior
- We're getting steamrolled by a planned economy
Pick one.
So what you're saying is you need Daddy Trump to bail you out with taxpayer dollars we don't have so you can not change anything to make vehicles nobody can afford?
I don't want cars to survive.
This is the very same extreme capitalism that they have enjoyed, engineered, abused. Live by the sword, die by the sword. Or, rapidly change expectations for what they charge. They cannot have it both ways
Legacy car makers have become complacent. They wouldn't survive doing the same thing they have been doing. They will adapt or die, competition is good.