Ask Lemmy
A Fediverse community for open-ended, thought provoking questions
Rules: (interactive)
1) Be nice and; have fun
Doxxing, trolling, sealioning, racism, toxicity and dog-whistling are not welcomed in AskLemmy. Remember what your mother said: if you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all. In addition, the site-wide Lemmy.world terms of service also apply here. Please familiarize yourself with them
2) All posts must end with a '?'
This is sort of like Jeopardy. Please phrase all post titles in the form of a proper question ending with ?
3) No spam
Please do not flood the community with nonsense. Actual suspected spammers will be banned on site. No astroturfing.
4) NSFW is okay, within reason
Just remember to tag posts with either a content warning or a [NSFW] tag. Overtly sexual posts are not allowed, please direct them to either !asklemmyafterdark@lemmy.world or !asklemmynsfw@lemmynsfw.com.
NSFW comments should be restricted to posts tagged [NSFW].
5) This is not a support community.
It is not a place for 'how do I?', type questions.
If you have any questions regarding the site itself or would like to report a community, please direct them to Lemmy.world Support or email info@lemmy.world. For other questions check our partnered communities list, or use the search function.
6) No US Politics.
Please don't post about current US Politics. If you need to do this, try !politicaldiscussion@lemmy.world or !uspolitics@lemmy.world
7) No Hit-and-Run questions.
Please don't delete your post for no apparent reason. If you plan on deleting a question later, say so in the post, or if you feel that you have a good reason to remove it, message a mod beforehand. It's not fair to the ones who took their time to answer, and it's not in the spirit of the community.
8) No Bots.
Posts or comments from bots, LLM's, AIs, Neural Networks, Transformers, or Marvin the Paranoid Android are not welcome in AskLemmy. Real humans only please.
Reminder: The terms of service apply here too.
Partnered Communities:
Logo design credit goes to: tubbadu
view the rest of the comments
Everyone is political. Politics is where alternate perspectives intersect in a social setting. Everything in life that involves multiple individuals shaping a shared experience is politics, and so you cannot functionally be the thing you claim. To say "I'm not political" is actually to say "I am afraid of taking a stand, I can't handle conflict, and what I believe means less to me than the risks I fear for showing it". Be political, embrace having views and things you care about and being ready to advocate for them, stand for them, and act, because I promise you the people who don't believe your perspective matters or can be tolerated are acting on their beliefs.
The reason I say I’m not ‘political’ has nothing to do whatsoever with what you said, it’s the fact that my views don’t align with any one ‘area’. There are points on the left I agree with there are points on the left I disagree with. There are points on the right I agree with, there are points I disagree with. There are point in the centre I agree with, there are points I disagree with. Same with every other area on the political spectrum. Why would I call myself anywhere if I don’t fully agree with anything anyone says? And if the political spectrum is all there is to be associated with politics, why should I call myself political if I don’t fit neatly anywhere? I’ll defend my own views, but I’ll never call myself here or there, because I don’t agree with here or there, except for a few points, but then disagree with that same area on many other points. So please, don’t accuse me of ‘not standing up’ etc. you don’t know my reasoning for why I described myself as such and such.
"you don’t know my reasoning for why I described myself as such and such."
Well this is true, because you have given me nothing to work with. It's okay to be afraid of expressing your views directly, and take the cowardly stance of "I believe a bit of everything but will also say nothing specific to avoid scrutiny", it's human. That doens't make you non-political, however. Like Rush proclaimed: "If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice". This is why undecided IS a political faction. You're still part of society even if you refuse to stand with any particular set of views or are incapable of expressing your own unique constellation of them. You still contribute to and benefit from systems that existed before you, even though you never had a choice to join or not; we are born into these systems, and I have sympathy for not wanting to feel part of them. But you really do need to be aware, refusing to engage is a luxury, and a reflection of your relevent level of comfort in society. People who are threatened by the rise of far-right ideology, and I mean that in a very material and existential sense, do not have the luxury of choosing not to choose. Some day you might not either, this is not a judgement on you perosnally, it's a wake up call.
It’s nothing to do with avoiding scrutiny, I simply don’t, as I tried to explain above, don’t fit on the political spectrum, hence why I don’t describe myself as following any specific party politics. I’m perfectly happy to discuss my opinions (ask me about any one and I’ll tell you I’m not avoiding scrutiny) I’m simply saying: my opinions don’t belong to any party/allegiance. That’s all. Example: in against gay rights, but I’m also against migrants being banned from entering my country (except if they’re dangerous). That’s an example about how my views don’t fit to left or right neatly and why I don’t call myself as belonging to any political party/anywhere on the political spectrum.
I understand not wanting to bear the labels of a group because that often comes with being tied to some views you don't express or believe. This is the issue with party politics, as it's not realistic to expect people to perfectly slot into a whole set of beliefs, we all have unique lived experience and so also unique profiles of understanding of the world we live in. It's even more understandable when you consider how commonly the poisoned political discourse weaponizes labels to taint how people view your stance on one subject by associating it with other beliefs, or making up imaginary sets of beliefs to weigh down something most people would agree with (e.g. people should have freedom of movement, or some core element of privacy and a right to individuality in their lives). This is the importace of discource, and being able to challenge and advocate ideas together, and it's what we've gradually been robbed of by social and legacy medias stealing the attention and the venues in which we have access to healthy discourse. I persoanlly think this reflex away from political engagement by saying 'I'm not political', is conditioned, and a response to how badly our societies have been fractured by monied interests, and that also ties in to the nature of the post. This all helps extremist groups recruit siloed individuals and indoctrinate them with a single set of views.
I won't get into your stated views, though I'd love to, that's not really the point here with the spirit of the post. I more appreciate your wilingness to state them. I know if we discussed them we would find areas of agreement, and middlegrounds to share because discourse is ultimately how you refine your closely held beliefs, and how you discover new understanding. It's also how we build ideas worth mobilizing politically over to encourage change that will benefit us on lines of common interest. This is part of how you can see that crippling discourse enables class warfare and helps special interest lobbies advocate for their own interests at the expense of the majority, by occupying the void of activism. Be political, it's intrinsic to human nature to participate socially, we're evolved to do this and it's the only reason our species earned this place in nature.
Perhaps I didn’t really word my initial statement quite right: I’m political, just not party political. I have ‘political’ views, they just don’t align well at any one point, and so I don’t describe myself as on any particular point, After reading your post, I think you get what I’m saying, though.
That could be, and I definitely understand and sympathize with that stance a lot more. Sorry for coming across aggressively, I'm used to people refusing to engage but also complaining about the state of their world, so I don't have a lot of tolerance for neutrality these days.
Fair enough. I get that — I don’t like people presuming the wrong intent of my words.
Neither do I, which is why it's important to be clear with them.