Today I Learned
What did you learn today? Share it with us!
We learn something new every day. This is a community dedicated to informing each other and helping to spread knowledge.
The rules for posting and commenting, besides the rules defined here for lemmy.world, are as follows:
Rules (interactive)
Rule 1- All posts must begin with TIL. Linking to a source of info is optional, but highly recommended as it helps to spark discussion.
** Posts must be about an actual fact that you have learned, but it doesn't matter if you learned it today. See Rule 6 for all exceptions.**
Rule 2- Your post subject cannot be illegal or NSFW material.
Your post subject cannot be illegal or NSFW material. You will be warned first, banned second.
Rule 3- Do not seek mental, medical and professional help here.
Do not seek mental, medical and professional help here. Breaking this rule will not get you or your post removed, but it will put you at risk, and possibly in danger.
Rule 4- No self promotion or upvote-farming of any kind.
That's it.
Rule 5- No baiting or sealioning or promoting an agenda.
Posts and comments which, instead of being of an innocuous nature, are specifically intended (based on reports and in the opinion of our crack moderation team) to bait users into ideological wars on charged political topics will be removed and the authors warned - or banned - depending on severity.
Rule 6- Regarding non-TIL posts.
Provided it is about the community itself, you may post non-TIL posts using the [META] tag on your post title.
Rule 7- You can't harass or disturb other members.
If you vocally harass or discriminate against any individual member, you will be removed.
Likewise, if you are a member, sympathiser or a resemblant of a movement that is known to largely hate, mock, discriminate against, and/or want to take lives of a group of people, and you were provably vocal about your hate, then you will be banned on sight.
For further explanation, clarification and feedback about this rule, you may follow this link.
Rule 8- All comments should try to stay relevant to their parent content.
Rule 9- Reposts from other platforms are not allowed.
Let everyone have their own content.
Rule 10- Majority of bots aren't allowed to participate here.
Unless included in our Whitelist for Bots, your bot will not be allowed to participate in this community. To have your bot whitelisted, please contact the moderators for a short review.
Partnered Communities
You can view our partnered communities list by following this link. To partner with our community and be included, you are free to message the moderators or comment on a pinned post.
Community Moderation
For inquiry on becoming a moderator of this community, you may comment on the pinned post of the time, or simply shoot a message to the current moderators.
view the rest of the comments
They are given due process, including access to lawyers, evidence, and witnesses. They're even allowed to take the case to court. All public universities are required to offer full due process when expelling students.
Private universities are not required to do so because they're not run by the government.
Your question is a little hyperbolic since what your talking about is title IX specifically, not “human rights” in general.
You can read about title IX exemptions here.
How are they being denied basic human rights?
Title IX is very specific and the organization you refer to, FACE, specifically states their goal in relation to title IX.
I can’t tell if your arguing in bad faith or you don’t understand title IX compared to other laws that would apply.
An anonymous poster posts a story in Reddit…
This reminds me of a reddit post from a while ago. Dude is going to a university in the US. He's randomly contacted by campus police to let him know that a student has taken out a restraining order on him. He's a graduate student, and the student who took out the restraining order is from one of his classes that's typically for undergrads. Other than sharing that class, he doesn't know the student. Never even spoken to them. He's on a student visa, if he's expelled, he'll likely be deported. He's not allowed to speak to the student and campus police won't even tell him why the restraining order is in place.
After doing some investigation on his own, he finds out the student is dating one of his roommates, who he also doesn't know very well. The roommate is stalking the student, and another roommate is helping the stalker.
The student who took out the restraining order had seen him with the stalker at some point and, because the class they share is typically for undergrads, assumed he only took the class to keep an eye on the student for the stalker.
He was able to go to his graduate advisor about it and luckily it all got cleared up, the student withdrew the restraining order. But his whole academic career was nearly derailed because a random person was able to take out a restraining order on him with zero direct evidence, and there was no established means by which he could defend himself.
"Campus Police" are regular police (for all that's worth), not rent-a-cops. Their jurisdiction is University and University-related policing. Think of the University as being its own city.
I teach nights at a university and UPD is pretty great. The city cops are very much out to get people, whereas the UPD has a very light touch. They'll bust a party with a bunch of 19yo Kids drinking too much and getting loud, and tell them to keep it down and stay safe, while offering to call a non-police volunteer to drive anyone home for free.
Parking Services (not part of UPD) can get go suck on a tailpipe though. Fuck those guys.
Due process protects you from the government. You don't get due process when you get kicked out of a private business or university for misbehaving. They can kick you out for no reason at all.
Then maybe Cornell shouldn’t have impeded a real investigation here.
Getting fired is life changing yet we accept that we could be fired at any time for no reason here in the US. Protections against getting arbitrarily kicked out of a private university would require legislation. Right now that's a risk you assume when you go to a private institution versus a public one.
Actually it's a pre requisite for being a politician or clergy member.
What do you think having to drop out of University because of the trauma of being raped does to a person?
So two wrongs make a right? This person had their life horribly disrupted for reason A so an unrelated person should have their life horribly disrupted for reason B?
People should not be subject to arbitrary harm from others and we should be against all forms of it, whether that's sexual assault, economic coercion or lack of due process.
When universities hide evidence, don't report to authorities, and otherwise dodge investigating rape accusations, then people aren't going to trust when they exonerate these men.
This is on the system that protects these rapists.
Due process is also a system that can make things like racism, sexism, nepotism harder. Also outside of universities people often feel like the legal system protects offenders, but it in a well functioning system it also protects them. After all, without due process, rape victims themselves can also be expelled by universities.
And when a legal system doesn't work, it needs fixing. People fought hard for legal protections to put in place in the first place.
Over 90% of perpetrators of sexual assault and rape never see the inside of a courtroom.
It needs fixing.
I don't know about this case, if that is true then its terrible and he should have been arrested, convicted and thrown out of the university. But the larger point stands, denying some people of due process because others are harmed in other ways is not something to strive for.
The rape victims at these universities deserve due process as well. As in a legit investigation and not hiding of evidence to protect these men.
Absolutely, I haven't seen anyone in this thread say anything suggesting otherwise, everyone deserves that. But that means not throwing people out of a university without evidence.
Universities don’t throw people out because they hide the evidence
Not when universities have the ability to hide evidence and obfuscate real investigations in order to protect these men. Which they have done time and time again.
This is not the best system we have. We can't even get the police to process rape kits.
Why do you think these stories are getting such traction right now?
These investigations were corrupt.
No, innocent until proven guilty is only the bar for the government to lock you up in a cage. It's impossible for anyone to live their life using that standard.