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Humans learn to lie before we learn to talk. It’s in our very nature to lie and lie often.
Society itself is held up loosely by a web of agreed apon lies.
That fact sounds like a lie.
It doesn’t sound like anything. It’s text. But yes babies can fake cry.
We learn to hit eachother at you young age as well but nobody would use that to justify hitting people once they're adults.
Sometimes hitting people is necessary, correct.
Lies don’t always hurt people. Most lies we tell help maintain our society. Like not insulting grandmas cooking.
See the roadblock you are hitting is you think I’m “lies are never wrong!” What I’m saying is it’s natural and not inherently wrong.
Pooping isn’t right or wrong. It’s something we have to do tho. That doesn’t mean you should shit ON people. It means you are going to shit it’s natural and normal. There is a time and place for it. Once you accept that you can plan around it. You learn to control it.
Same with hitting. Hitting isn’t inherently good or bad. We hit nails with hammers, we hit people when attacked. The reason is either good or bad. Hitting is nutral. We hit things all day every day.
Ask yourself honestly: if you had never known the concept of hitting someone else, you had no ability to ever hit anyone. Would you be better off?
Cheating your partner also doesn't hurt them for as long as they don't find out.
Telling white lies indicates that you consider yourself to be a better judge of the other person's ability to handle uncomfortable information. You're treating them as emotionally immature person who needs to be sheltered from the real world like a child. You're not only lying but also disrespecting them.
Unless you're hiding Anne Frank on your attic, there's very few situations that justify lying. Same applies to violence.
Here's a simple queston: in what situation would you want to be lied to?
Cheating on you’re partner is wrong. That’s the wrong thing in that situation. I’ve never cheated on anyone.
“Telling white lies indicates-“ it really doesn’t. When a baby fake cries it isn’t being mean. It isn’t judging someone’s else’s maturity.
Everyone is constantly sheltered from the real world. We shelter ourselves with something called “society”. We flat out made up civilization. We maintain it partially by lying.
Emotional maturity. Let me ask you this: you are at thanksgiving with the entire family. Grandma asks you how the turkey was. You say in front of the hole family “I hated it”. Would youre family be proud of you? Would grandma be happy you valued her enough to tell her the truth? Or would the whole table look at you like a monster?
What situation would I like to be lied to in?
Well you mentioned Anne frank. Let’s go back there because there is a part in the book with a funeral.
The parents tell all the kids a family member died and all the kids are sad. Anne looks into the coffin to find it’s empty. The family lied to her. She was hurt. Then soldiers come in to question them. All the other kids didn’t realize there was a problem because they thought they were at a real funeral. Anne was scared because she knew the truth and now had to hide it.
In that situation I’d rather not know.
Another personal example. My ex wife and I lived in the same small town. I was a district manager for dollar tree. My exwife was around town and heard two of my managers complaining about a task I had asked them to do. They were talking shit essentially.
She shouldn’t have told me. They didn’t say anything that I needed to worry about, they weren’t confused about the task, it didn’t happen at work… there was nothing I needed to do with that information. People complain about thier boss after work sometimes. That’s natural.
I wish she hadn’t told me because there was nothing for me to say or do, nothing actionable with that information. She just wanted me to know they were talking shit to try an upset me.
So let me ask you this: was her telling me the useless information just to hurt me ethical? Would keeping it to herself be less ethical? Should my employees tell me everyday I’m there that working is hard and it would be easier if I don’t give them tasks? Would that honesty help anyone? Should I pull them aside and tell them I don’t like it when they complain about me outside of work? Should I tell them my ex wife is nosey and crazy?
Who need to know what? Who’s acting ethically and who isn’t?
Actually my exwife was cheating on her new husband at that time. I knew but didn’t tell her husband. I ALSO knew her husband was cheating on her and didn’t say anything. That had nothing to do with judgment, anger, or who can handle what. I didn’t say anything because I didn’t care and didn’t want to be involved. Is that unethical?
Should I tell my son his mothers crazy? Should I tell him his mother cheated on me so I left her?
What about outing someone who’s gay or trans without thier permission?
What if someone’s mother dies and they say “she’s an angel now watching over me” should I correct them that angels are not human and humans are not angels? Is it a good time to explain that the Bible never says anything about seeing our family in the afterlife, instead it heavily implies you won’t miss them or look for them? Should I just tell them god doesn’t exist and dead is dead?
There are loads of time where we have to lie to have a society and exist with other people.
Hearing that doesn't mean much when it comes from someone who just wrote a wall of text declaring how you're willing to lie when that can prevent you or someone else feeling uncomfortable emotions.
That's the point: liars by definition can't be trusted. If I can't trust your no, I can't trust your yes either.
What can’t be trusted is people who don’t know themselves.
You aren’t any different. You have lied and will lie some more. If you can never trust a liar then you can never trust anyone lol
You haven’t made any arguments. Did you see that?
You refused to answer even a single one of my questions but I answered yours.
You didn’t comment on my answers to your questions. You instead went back to basically “it’s wrong” without any explanation as to why.
You can’t be trusted.
I’m over here with lots of examples, you are just making stuff up like “well you only do that because you think they can’t handle-“ nonsense. I even showed you examples were that couldn’t possibly be the case. So you just complain I wrote a lot as you’re argument?! I’m explaining to you how it works lol
You can stomp you’re feet and declare yourself right… but you’d be lying to yourself.
Society can only exist in a world where we lie and lie often. Every social creature in the animal kingdom has the ability to deceive others. That’s just part of being in a group.
You cannot live without lies as a human being. No more than you can exist without shitting.
You don’t have to like it but it’s the truth.
So since you don’t care enough to listen to me at all, or consider anything at all being said, or even have a stable conversation that actually goes anywhere at all.
I’ll just simply remind you that you are wrong and leave it at that.
No we fucking don't.
Babies can and do fake cry. Being deceptive is a vital part of living in a society. You cannot have this world we live in without lies.
It’s true we have to learn to lie well but the want and ability to be deceptive when it suits us is something we are born with.