this post was submitted on 16 Oct 2026
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    For those unaware, Linus Torvalds this year has deeply cast his lot with the hyperscale LLMs for development of Linux code, dismissing arguments that this is an abdication of responsibility over that code base.

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    [–] rtxn@lemmy.world 1 points 1 hour ago

    Locking the post because the Twitter-grade arguments are starting again.

    [–] Artemis_Mystique@lemmy.ml 6 points 22 hours ago (2 children)

    guys linus is pushing retirement, the nobodies shitting this much on his frankly amazing legacy is astounding.

    yall would be running cuck license Operating Systems if it werent for him and RMS

    [–] pifox@pawb.social 3 points 7 hours ago (1 children)

    I mean you can shit on this descision and still respect his legacy. Linus still has one the greatest achievement in the foss space with the Linux kernel, and it's fustrating seeing the acceptance of AI code into it.

    [–] Artemis_Mystique@lemmy.ml 1 points 6 hours ago

    and it's fustrating seeing the acceptance of AI code into it.

    and its frustating to see pushback against it.

    [–] bignose@programming.dev 2 points 14 hours ago

    yall would be running cuck license Operating Systems if it werent for him and RMS

    The best institutions outgrow the failings of their founders. Let's hope Free Software can.

    [–] phoenixz@lemmy.ca 15 points 1 day ago (3 children)

    Again: LLM's are tools. If used right, tools are great, and LLM's CAN be great for certain tasks. As far as I can tell, that is Torvald's position as well; use tools as tools.

    [–] ruby@lemmy.dbzer0.com 12 points 22 hours ago

    hate this reductionist phrase trying to frame llms as neutral tech and the premise that you just have to learn to "use it right".

    this tech sucks up power like crazy, devalues human knowledge and art, deskills workers on a massive scale, aids in global surveillance, demands data centers that displace people, spits out code that violates the licensing of a huge number of projects, drives hardware prices through the roof. then it statistically generates some plausible-looking code and gives you a little productivity boost followed by a technical debt that we'll just kick down the line and deal with later.

    in the current version they're pretty unethical on every grounds. free software devs, espicially those with gpl'd projects, should know it better than anyone.

    any other "tools" that do that?

    [–] Hawk@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 points 1 day ago

    I agree with his position, but he completely skips the moral issues using current LLMs, which is the big problem here.

    [–] littleomid@feddit.org 4 points 1 day ago

    LLMd are not tools. A hammer is a tool. A stochastic appliance can not be a tool.

    [–] aesthelete@lemmy.world 27 points 2 days ago

    Reposted from elsewhere:

    Linus on the Linux kernel (after writing a single python script w/ an LLM):

    Let's slop em up

    [–] Hobo@lemmy.world 20 points 2 days ago (4 children)

    People really twist themselves in knots to defend their heros huh?

    [–] HouseWolf@pawb.social 25 points 1 day ago (1 children)

    It's just kinda to stupid to treat anyone as infallible.

    It kinda comes with being a human.

    [–] anarchy79@lemmy.world -1 points 21 hours ago* (last edited 21 hours ago)

    Nope. If anyone makes any mistake in their life that is cause to cancel them permanently. In fact, if anyone even says something I remotely disapprove of, me and my friends will make sure to hound them for eternity. Don't try to change for the better, either, we all know what you did.

    [–] Funkt4st1c@lemmy.world 10 points 1 day ago

    No one should have statues made of them. We are remembered by momentary glimpses of greatness in the overwhelming sea of mediocrity. Something something typewriters

    [–] anarchy79@lemmy.world 5 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

    I don't know, I have a lot of confidence in his capabilities as an engineer and a pioneer.

    I have serious misgivings about this choice, but I'm willing to hear him out because he's not just some rando.

    [–] OldChicoAle@lemmy.world 6 points 2 days ago

    It's a trauma response

    [–] urandom@lemmy.world 32 points 2 days ago

    While the mass net on AI is absurdly stupid for a variety of reasons, his stance is quite reasonable.

    Also, I think he mostly reviews code nowadays. His AI usage is then likely not going to be that different from what he’s doing now. Except that he would swear at toasters instead of people.

    [–] DjangoFett@lemmy.zip 63 points 2 days ago (18 children)

    Copying my comment from another post that cherry-picked a specific quote of his, but ultimately I believe still applies.

    My last use of AI is in my post history and was fairly down voted because I was being foolishly ironic.

    This said, I don't really disagree with his take here despite keeping away from AI as much as I am reasonably able. I do my own critical thinking and hate that I have to jump through hoops on the internet to have a simple question answered without some layman's AI summary that may or may not be even remotely correct or actionable. Even still, when I asked it to check on local real estate laws and provide summaries of possible actions based on a very strict set of parameters, it gave me information that my wife and I were able to bring to a human agent and have things work out better than we had actually expected.

    I think a better way of putting it - and I'm still gonna ruffle feathers - is that AI is becoming the new electricity.

    Put down your pitchfork and lemme explain.

    When electricity came out, people rather reasonably pointed out that simply coming into contact with an electrical device could result in death if one wasn't careful. On top of that, the infrastructure required for it was expensive, unsightly, and at the time incredibly disruptive to daily life. It was going to ruin and disrupt entire industries that had existed for centuries because it could do things a human could not do unaided.

    All of this is to one degree or another entirely true even through to modern times, but electricity has become a ubiquitous resource that humanity would now deeply struggle to live without. I won't dare compare AI that far as i genuinely believe humans would be significantly better off without it, but the initial Luddite response to electricity has a historical echo here.

    I think Linus' point is more that it can undoubtedly be a useful tool when used in a measured, controlled, intelligent manner, and that it is a genie that is very clearly unwilling to be put back in its bottle. Like it or not it exists, and while we can absolutely be unhappy about it, being blind to its actual real world beneficial uses because the companies that make it are actual festering waste is a bit silly - especially when in the hands of the right chaotic neutral parties these companies are about to have a massive lesson in just how messy their tools have made things.

    [–] naught101@lemmy.world 125 points 2 days ago (39 children)

    You should read up on thr Luddites, because you're mischaracterising them. They weren't anti technology, they were anti capitalist.

    IMO, this is the think Linus is missing - the shit has massive political implications in multiple dimensions (it's being built by fascists and capitalists bent on control of broader business, government, and social systems) and he's just treating it as if it's as politically agnostic as a screwdriver.

    [–] soupcon@lemmy.blahaj.zone 37 points 2 days ago

    Yes, though it goes further than that even if you ignore the politics.

    Linus is undoubtedly talking about when an LLM is used in a very specific way in his imagination where it's helping a competent programmer spot some things they might have missed, but the programmer is still diligent and professional and genuinely does take responsibility for ensuring the quality of their commits. Where the delusion comes in is grossly overestimating how many people are actually like that outside of his inner circle of world-level experts. What's happening in all the other open-source projects is a flood of low quality garbage PRs from meat proxies.

    [–] 100_kg_90_de_belin@thelemmy.club 22 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (2 children)

    It may be that Linus Torvalds has the political literacy of a doorstop.

    [–] Dojan@pawb.social 8 points 1 day ago

    He's a rich, middle-aged, white man from the Nordics.

    As a white man from the Nordics, my observation is that his particular demographic doesn't tend to care much. They have theirs.

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    [–] Zarobi@aussie.zone 45 points 2 days ago (6 children)

    I'll also copy my comment from another thread that defended LLMs as a neutral tool

    If nobody lost their job, it didn't convince people to kill themselves, was environmentally friendly, didn't guzzle enormous amounts of water and electricity, wasn't used for mass surveillance and propaganda, didn't devalue art and destroy human culture, didn't contribute to the brain rot epidemic, didn't destroy an entire generation's education, didn't hoard computing resources, didn't hack everyone at any opportunity, then yeah it could have been a pretty cool technology actually

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    [–] ZILtoid1991@lemmy.world 5 points 1 day ago (3 children)

    First I was going to reply with the "I ain't going to read all of that" meme.

    Then I realized you'd use that as an argument later on to defend AI, so I read it.

    I have read the same exact arguments so many times, that I just wasted my time on nothing. I'm won't bother to write the same exact rebuttals I (and others) already have.

    Yet AI bros get all angry if we artists dare to draw fanart, because we draw something that already existed. Maybe their brains got cooked by the promise of "infinite, original, and personalized" content...

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    [–] lime@feddit.nu 29 points 2 days ago (3 children)

    in a vacuum i would agree with his take but the entire thing is inextricably linked to theft and massive copyright infringement. until the matter is settled in court there's no way to know if using these things professionally is even legal. it's a potential poison pill for the kernel and the fact that he's not acknowledging that is insane to me.

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