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You should have instilled enough simple lessons in your child that in preteen to teen years they can operate on their own with guidance. You are a parent and you will always be their parents but you change from a teacher to live in guidance counselor to an older friend who is looking out for you when you are an adult.
I find parents have trouble switching between authoritarian teacher owner to friendly helpful roommates.
Hahaha. I have both. My dad died my close friend, while mum is still my mum.
Never.
You're supposed to love and protect your kids as long as possible.
I think at some point you need to stop barricading them from the dangers and learn to just let them fall, while helping them get up again. It teaches them the value of the rules you've been trying to impart, while still being a protector.
Not to the degree in OP's post. If your kids are 30 and you're dictating what they should do without any input from them, that's a problem.
Whem your kids are adults, you don't get to make decisions for them anymore. You can give guidance and advice, but you don't get to decide what they do
There's a huge difference between loving your kid and giving them unsolicited advice, which is what it sounds like was happening in OP's post.
I love my kids, and always will. And I'll help them however I can. But I'm already checking myself if they push back against any advice I'm giving - if they don't want to hear it, they won't hear it; whether I speak it or not!
Dude americans have a weird thing about "leting children go" right after high school. I was 17yo when I finished high school, I was still a minor. Also why?! Care to love the kids YOU wanted to have wtf?! When I divorced my ex my parents asked me to come home and they wouldn't let me go, even after a while, just becaus "it's so good to have you home". Lov mom
True. I'm asian and have some of the family thing, but i studied in the us, so used to be very impressed how they can up and go to cities across the country for college and work. They express family love differently, though, and are allowed to have contrary opinions to the family which is often frowned upon in Asia. Oh, and family hierarchy is also handled differently. I always got the sense that the kids would happily throw down with the dad if it came to it, whereas in Asia its more a reluctant compliance.
When should parents stop parenting and teaching their children? Never - they’re parents. That’s the job.
Don't become parents.
I‘m 30 and my parents give me unwanted advice all the time. I’m very rebellious about it since it never went away. And a lot of times when I listened to them it turned out to be bad.
They’re also constantly judging my financial decisions, despite them only having money saved due to recent inheritance.
Right? I feel the parents who don't let go just create resentment and active rebellion against their unsolicited advice.
Don't know anything about your situation but seeing it at face value for other readers.... your parents giving advice on how to do something when they failed isn't necessarily bad advice. We learn by our mistakes. Why not learn from theirs.
My parents will give advice if I ask for it. It's been that way since I was about 14 or 15. If they tried to treat me like you are describing, especially in public, I would shut it down.
The only time I can imagine them giving unsolicited advice would be if I were in a romantic relationship they thought was bad. I don't agree with a lot of their perspectives on relationships, but I would at least hear them out. They would have the good sense to do it in private though and would be able to explain their thoughts, no "I don't have to justify myself to you" nonsense.
I would say they were a little too uninvolved at times, but I would take that over the scenario you are describing with them over involved at 30+.
Yes, it takes maturity to understand the difference between hearing it out and obedience to the advice given. We mirror our life experiences to our kids, so I guess one thing I'm cognizant of is whether I'm repeating what I felt was not right to the next generation.
As a parent, our job is to prepare you to be an adult, and our involvement should gradually decrease over time.
As babies, you have no capacity for self-determination. You literally can't decide where you are or what you do. You're luggage that can scream.
As you get older you become capable of more, and as parents, we should be giving you more responsibility over the choices you make.
Here in the U.S., from a legal point of view, your parents are responsible for you up to the age 18. Regardless of how much freedom you're allowed before 18, your parents are on the hook for any damages.
At 18, that changes. Now you're legally an adult, and you are responsible for all your choices. However, your brain development is incomplete, and you haven't developed the ability to fully comprehend the future consequences of your actions.
From 18 to about 27, you should be making your own decisions, but your parents should be available for advice or rescue when you make a mistake. The idea is for you to make mistakes, but have the support to be able to learn from them.
From there, parents should continue to step back. Advice can always be given, but it is up to the child whether to take it, and as parents we have no say in what advice children follow.
Personally, I'll always be available to help any of my kids in any way I can. However, at this point my job is not to actually intervene until asked. I can, however, initiate the conversation when necessary.
Spot on. Great post.
Unfortunately many disagree as they are advocating for and celebrating children as young as 4-5 having autonomy and being able to make life long permanent decisions, with teachers etc being told to withhold info from parents and affirm whatever they want. Governments the world over are trying to take parental rights and control away because it’s much easier to control and mould kids when they’re young. Make them government dependant as early as possible and you have nice easily controlled voters for life.
Uh... Ok.
Thanks for your well written input and perspective. I was sent away from an early age (13) for education. I went through the cycle of emotions, and while I had a guardian nearby, I gradually learned to be independent and now wouldn't trade the experience for anything in the world.
After that, college and moving out seemed like a easy, natural thing to do. Now I sometimes meet people in their mid 40s who have literally no life skills to speak of, can't manage finances or keep a home tidy, and are looking at marriage as a 'get out of jail free' card for the rest of their lives. I treasure my independence, but can't understand why people would prefer to be so cloistered and coddled. No, scratch that, it's obviously 'so much easier'.
I've definitely met people who were not raised to be independent of their parents. It sadly seems to often be the rule rather than the exception.
I think that is a side effect of living at home with your parents for longer, something that is becoming more and more common with the unsustainable cost of living.
In my experience, it doesn't have anything to do with kids living at home longer.
It's more related to the issues of the parents. Control issues, lack of purpose, lack of independence on the part of the parents.
Some parents just fail to prepare their kids for life. All of my kids had roommates in college who didn't know how to do laundry, or cook food, or clean up after themselves.
Other parents go out of their way to keep their children dependent on them. I think that is usually because the parents don't know what to do with their lives if their kids move on.
To be fair, some parents see their kids as an excuse to be irresponsible themselves, e.g so they don't have to plan for retirement. I come from a religiously conservative country, and it's common to have families with incomes of below $8k/ year having 5 or more kids. The result is a while bunch of voting adults with no functional education. Youth delinquency is a thing here.
And then telling your child that everything they do that wasn't YOUR idea is making them a fuckup and that you just are trying to help them does wonders.
Then gasping when the child tells you to drop fucking dead and goes no contact and moves 3k miles away.
Note: this was all mostly unrelated to the comment aside from what you wrote triggered these thoughts.
Yeah.
Generally my wife and I keep the, "oh crap is this going to be a shitshow" conversations between ourselves.
The only way the kids get a reaction beyond a raised eyebrow and an amused smile is if the fuck up in question is going to push the limits of my ability to fix.
If it goes beyond $1000, they might get a "what the fuck?!?" out of me, but it's more in the nature of a momentary loss of control and is really just what my body does while my brain is trying to figure out how to cover it. However, if they fucked up, they already know it. If they fucked up by ignoring my advice, they know that too. There's no need to rehash it.
Generally, the biggest problem I have is they want to be independent, so they tend to try to keep their problems to themselves until they grow too big to deal with.
If you ask my mom, she'd say I do the same thing.
This sounds very reasonable and I concur
I'm in my mid 30s and I just texted my mom for advice on texting a stranger. I regularly ask her for advice on laundry, cooking, dishes. I still get my dad to review my resume when I apply for jobs. My parents don't get a choice but to keep parenting.
Do they sometimes give me unsolicited advice that's out of touch and sometimes even hurtful? Sure. Would I give up their parenting for anything else? Absolutely not.
Of course, I understand what an absolute privilege this is because not everyone has parents that are decent people.
All this to say, parent for as long as it is beneficial to your children. And if you're a child, listen to your parents for as long as it is beneficial to you.
I think parents should always be there, as a friend, advisor, confidant, etc. my question was about the overbearing types that want to control your life. Maybe it's about a lifestyle choice they disagree with, or a friend they don't like, etc.
(Sorry, replied to the main post with this earlier)
Fair enough, but see my last point: if your parents version of parenting is no longer serving you and is often harming you, then you as an adult can make the decision to walk away from that.
There's no real "age" rule here, it's a very personal decision, and I'd say it's more often a decision made by the child rather than the parent. Parents are gonna keep parenting for as long as they have offspring to listen to them, whether they're good at it or not.
Realistically they never stop, but if you have a working relationship with them, you and you parents will find a way to keep the parenting at a mostly helpful level.
Omg yes! Ths thing about my dad is that he was always 'reach-able', as in no matter what, you could always sit him down and he'd always hear you out, regardless of whether he agreed with you. I miss him :(
Parents will parent until they die
A child can choose to stop listening anytime after they're no longer financially reliant upon the parent
The answer is it depends….
This is the only thing I know about parenting, is that I didn’t know shit about parenting until I became one.
I just feel sometimes the parents are the problem, regardless of good intentions.
I agree with this. The hardest part about being a parent is doing what is needed, not what everyone wants.
Am Psych nurse.
Once walked in on a mother literally spoon-feeding a meal to a grownass approx. 30y/o man with 0 physical disabilities or cognitive deficits, just an uncomplicated depression with at most some mild personality disordered features.
It explained SO much about that patient presentation.
With age comes wisdom comes the understanding that control does not work with humans. It sacrifices part of them to get an outcome the parent wants. But the job of parenting never ends. In your 80s you will still want someone older who can show you what to do next. A parent that learns to support without controlling the kid will find themselves always able to parent their kid because the kid will always come to them for help.
I’m supporting my kids financially through their college years, so, for another 10-15 years. During that time, I get a say in the way they conduct themselves. I try to instill decent values, discipline, and stoke their own independence. But they are their own people and as they grow up, what I think will matter less to them. That’s fine. That’s normal. If they turn out to be assholes, I’ll attempt to intervene. If they start believing in weird bullshit, same. If they mistake their life of privilege for a lifelong entitlement, I will pull the rug out from under them. And if they’re doing good shit in life and need a hand, I’ll be there throughout my remaining years. By the time they’re 30, I hope they have their shit together and we see each other not just as family, but as friends. Lording over your kids until they’re adults is some bullshit. It’s the reason I have a dysfunctional relationship with my mother.
I’m supporting my kids financially ... I get a say in the way they conduct themselves...
Okay, so this is an employment situation then. Youre treating them like "you act certain ways/do certain things because I give you money."
That's an employer, not a parent.
Shit take but that’s cool.
I'm close to retirement and my Mom regularly tells me I shouldn't drink a beer after work so often because I might "turn into an alcoholic" 🙂 When I point out that I've been doing that for decades and I'm still not an alcoholic, she says "Oh yeah, you're all grown up now I guess..."
You'll always be your parents' baby boy or girl. They'll stop being overly protective and giving advice to you when they pass away, and then you'll miss it.
I’ve been doing that for decades [...] still not an alcoholic
Hmmmmmmm 🤔
While definitions vary, and a medical definition would typically include something about effects on one's life and general health rather than just a quantity drunk, "a beer after work" every day would not typically qualify as alcoholism. For example, the USDA's thresholds are one drink per day for women, or two for men.
My mum in a nutshell. Love her though.
Not sure I fully understand the question. Is this about parents trying to push their adult children to live their life a certain way?
If so, I'd say children should be allowed to exercise as much self-determination as can reasonably be afforded from pretty much toddlerhood, of course taking into account the danger of physical harm or lasting trauma. (Like, let your kid be interested in art at 3 years old and allow them to pursue it seriously as they get older even if you're a 4th-generation army brat. But don't let them jump off your roof at 3 to see if they can fly.) It's not so much that parents should "hold on" until a magic age is reached at which point they should "let go". If the parents are trying to get their 30-year-old son to quit being gay, or pursue a career in law rather than performance arts, or not play video games, or whatever, they probably weren't allowing for age-appropriate levels of self-determination when the kid was under 10 either and his raising could likely be described as an enmeshment sort of situation.
If that wasn't the nature of the feud at all, then who knows who if anyone might have been in the wrong. Like, telling your 30-year-old son to quit stealing money from their 85-year-old grandmother is probably entirely appropriate.
When the kid can stand on their own. Some never learn. Sometimes it's the parents' fault, sometimes the kid is missing something (some mental or physical or maybe psychological deficit).
When I was a kid, there came a time when I wanted as little to do with my folks as possible. I'd be out until just past dark ("when the streetlights come on" was the time we'd start heading home) and from a pretty young age. Like 9-10. We'd go for a mile or two, explore the world around us. Ride bikes to another neighborhood or (later) get on a county bus and go to another town. We didn't have cell phones, let alone pocket computers like kids have now.
I see kids as old as 8-10 still needing to cling to mommy's skirt or daddy's jeans. That could never have been us. And when they're not clinging to their parents, they're playing Minecraft or Fortnite or Roblox on a hand-me-down phone that doesn't call (and probably has its serial blocked for non-payment so it just works on WiFi) or a tablet. And I'm not generalizing. I know kids like this. Kids in my family are like this. I have no control over it. I've tried to tell them they should be out playing. They won't hear it. Family doesn't care. I'm the old man shouting at clouds. I imagine those kids will be living at home at 30 being told when to take a shower and when to go to bed. It's not just this generation, either. I have a couple aunts and an uncle (young Boomers/elder GenX) who were the same way. Minus the electronics, naturally.
Parents: Raise your kids to be independent, or they'll be your babies forever.
Some parents want their kids to be their babies. It's a psychological thing, or an insecure about the (parents own) future thing.
It's easy to say kids should be out playing, but where?
The place I grew up is unaffordable now to most even before adding the increased costs of children.
It's easy to say kids should be out playing, but what's on the internet is more compelling, and while it's pretty suspicious, we don't even have good data on whether it makes much difference.
When should parents stop parenting and just let the kid fail/ thrive on their own? I just feel sometimes the parents are the problem,
In what you described the issue is shared, imho. I mean, the parents are... doing what they probably have been doing during all teh childhood of their son, which is not their 'kid' anymore if he is that old: he is an adult. And, as an adult, I would say it's more than time for him to put limits. If parents/family can't respect those limits, it's up to him to help them, more or less gently, understand it's not for them to fix those boundaries.
I left my family, and their advice, and their morals, and their hypocrisy (things 'like when we were your age/we would never have done/and so on), the second I was able to. We all have a single life to live and I realized at a young age I did not wish for my parents to get a say in how I chose to live mine, they already did enough damage during my childhood.
I'd say when you move out, more or less, probably a bit after. So I'll say 21 years old. Maybe 25 for many, especially if they still live at home. But once they're out of the house they need to be more independent.
I'm 35 and I haven't felt 'parented' by my own parents since about 20, but every girl I've ever dated has had a closer relationship with their parents than I've had. The only thing I can tell you is that it's VERY common for girls in their 30's to still be talking to their parents 4x a week. I try to call home once every 2 weeks or so, which is apparently very distant compared to most families I know of.
when you move out
In this economy?
No, really.
Meme or not, more and more people literally do not have the money to be able to move out of their childhood home.
For those stuck in that situation, parents still have to know to ease off. A gentle reminder may be in order.
But - and this is an important part - the child needs to step up and start offering to do things around the place and pay towards bills if they've any sense about them. And then follow through and do things and pay up if those offers are taken up. Maybe even insist and be helpful by stealth if they aren't.
If grown offspring don't want to be treated like children, they need to get out of the "parents take care of everything" mindset.
Edit: I don't even have kids. I don't know where that last part came from.
