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212
US Army Poorly Prepared for Arctic Operations: Finnish Troops Forced Them to Surrender During Exercises in Norway - Militarnyi (militarnyi.com)
submitted 5 months ago by Latschenkiefer@feddit.org to c/europe@feddit.org
17 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 

https://ghostarchive.org/archive/Hc0i9

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[–] supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz 67 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

I 100% percent support making fun of the US and how incompetent and fascist we are but for the record I sure as HELL would never want to fight Finnish troops in Arctic conditions. The way people used to wax poetic about how russia's most powerful general is winter blah blah blah is far more fitting for the Finnish military.

Nah, considering the past conflicts Finland has been in and had to face down, I would not want to fuck with the Finnish in an arctic war, especially a messy prolonged one with infantry combat.

The Soviet Union invaded Finland on 30 November 1939, starting the Winter War, with the goal of annexing Finland.[1] An expected easy Soviet victory instead saw the Red Army suffer severe losses in men and materiel, and the attempt to conquer Finland failed. The war ended on 13 March 1940 with the signing of the Moscow Peace Treaty in which Finland ceded 9% of its territory to the Soviet Union.

Finland invaded the Soviet Union in June of 1941, initiating the Continuation War. Finland retook territory lost in the Winter War and proceeded to occupy East Karelia. The Soviets launched the Vyborg–Petrozavodsk offensive in June 1944 and drove Finland out of the territory it had taken, but the Finns halted the offensive with a string of victories, beginning with the Battle of Tali-Ihantala and ending with the Battle of Ilomantsi in August 1944. The Continuation War ended with the Moscow Armistice.

As part of the Moscow Armistice, Finland was obliged to drive out the Germans from Finnish territory, in what became the Lapland War. The war ended in April of 1945.

The Finns successfully resisted Soviet attempts to conquer Finland, making Finland one of two combatant continental European countries in World War II not to have its capital occupied (the other being the Soviet Union).[2]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_history_of_Finland

[–] AlexLost@lemmy.world 44 points 5 months ago

They fired all competent comanders and placed lackeys in all serious roles. It's not going to go well for them. They certainly have lots of toys and ammo though.

[–] Lanske@lemmy.world 17 points 5 months ago

From the article: " The organizers of the exercises were forced to ask Finnish reservists, who were playing the role of the enemy, to go easier on the Americans"

Go Finland!

[–] whyNotSquirrel@sh.itjust.works 17 points 5 months ago (2 children)

Don't they have any military bases in Alaska?

[–] Buelldozer@lemmy.today 24 points 5 months ago (2 children)

We do and you'll note that the article didn't specify which US troops partipated in this exercise. If it was troops stationed in Alaska then it's bad, if it was troops stationed in Missouri then it's understandable.

You also have to remember that the US expects to lose during exercises, especially when engaging subject matter experts like the Finns in the Arctic.

This is how they learn and get better.

[–] HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 4 points 5 months ago (2 children)

I've got my dad's old winter wear army jacket from when he was in the reserves. I can Donald Duck with that thing on and nothing else outdoors at 20°F/-6°C and be comfortable. It is toasty as fuck. So like, the US military used to know how to deal with cold.

[–] philpo@feddit.org 7 points 5 months ago (1 children)

-6° is not cold in the grand scheme of cold. That's fair weather in that region. Early autuum.

[–] HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world 1 points 5 months ago

yeah but i ain't donald ducked colder. can't speak to it.

[–] Liz@midwest.social 6 points 5 months ago

They still do. Military exercises are not about determining which side is better. It's about learning things, practicing things, simulating things, etc. Often times one side will fail and then the exercise will continue on as if they succeeded, because, again, the point is not to score wins and loses. It's fact-finding. It's training.

It's kind of like of the F35 loses in dogfights to older planes whenever they test that scenario. If the F35 is in a dogfight in real life, a completely unrealistic number of things have lined up and gone wrong for that pilot. In real life the F35 would just shoot the older planes out of the sky from the other side of the horizon.

[–] Saapas@piefed.zip 0 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Well the Finnish troops were also reservists, so not some top of the line troops

E: read more from Finnish sources, it was actually proper in North Finland served guys. Reservist could mean anything but these weren't some coastal boys from down south 

[–] corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca 1 points 5 months ago

I bet they stay home a lot. It's cold.

[–] HowRu68@lemmy.world 11 points 5 months ago

Only one of both has Sisu.

[–] Skua@kbin.earth 9 points 5 months ago

lol. lmao, even

[–] TankovayaDiviziya@lemmy.world 8 points 5 months ago

As expected. US hasn't had Arctic experience since World War II in Alaska, or at least some training on the climate and terrain since the end of Cold War. I saw some twats on social media scoff at the EU deployment of contingent troops to Greenland as small numbers. That attitude is typical of authoritarian simps who believe in might makes right; that brute force alone could solve anything. Just ask the Russians of their experience with the Finns and Ukrainians...

[–] Kissaki@feddit.org 7 points 5 months ago

It's insane that NATO gives Trump more access after his threats and vocal violations of international law.

Stationing US troops is a threat, a destabilization.

[–] Nangijala@feddit.dk 3 points 5 months ago

I mean... it's not really fair to put them against the Finns. Every country that shares a border with Russia knows how to fight. Adding snow and ice to the mix and you get the Finns and the Saami. You aren't gonna win against those guys if they are handed a hunting rifle.

[–] frustrated_phagocytosis@fedia.io 1 points 5 months ago

No shit