Ok, bigger instances ban more often. Not surprising, because they have more communities and more users and more trouble. But hang on, dbzer0 isn't a very big instance. What happens if we do a ratio of bans vs number of users?

Ok, so lemmy.ml, dbzer0 and pawb are issue an outsized amount of bans for the number of users they have... But surely the number of communities the instance hosts is going to mean they have to ban more? Bans are used to moderate communities, not just to shield their user-base from the outside. Let's look at the number of bans per community hosted:

Seems like dbzer0 really loves to ban. Even more than the marxists and the furries! What is it about dbzer0 that makes them such prolific banners?

Raw-ish numbers and calculations are in this spreadsheet if anyone wants to make their own charts.

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[–] meldrik@lemmy.wtf 14 points 1 week ago

Is this permanent bans and/or temporary bans?

[–] Aatube@kbin.melroy.org 12 points 1 week ago (9 children)

the decision to graph per-community (i'll call those "commag"s) doesn't make sense to me. it seems to me like a bad approximation for lifetime total users that doesn't control for either instance attitudes on commag creation or troll account registration (these usually don't create communities). i'm unacquainted with pawb but i wouldn't think they're very ban-happy, and the fact that these graphs show them as twice as ban-happy per-community as, and a bit more ban happy than ml should tell you this isn't very good methodology.

it seems more like dbzer0 and pawb don't create many communities (but don't close stale ones either, unlike .world), which makes sense as the ones that do exist are quite focused and targetted to the instance userbase.

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[–] ModernRisk@lemmy.dbzer0.com 12 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Ah, time for some drama entertainment. I already grabbed the popcorn and some drinks.

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[–] Jumi@lemmy.world 12 points 1 week ago

Me, scrolling through the comments:

[–] Grainne@lemmy.dbzer0.com 11 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

Hi Rimu,

I see you’ve banned one of the communities I moderate !europe@lemmy.dbzer0.com, deleting it entirely from your instance and denying access to members who had subscribed from there.

Two questions if you don’t mind. Why are you so ban happy? Was there something wrong with the community or was this based on your personal feelings of a particular user?

[–] rimu@piefed.social 10 points 1 week ago (41 children)

Please see https://piefed.social/c/piefed_help/p/2025442/europe-lemmy-dbzer0-com-banned-from-piefed

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[–] atopi@piefed.blahaj.zone 11 points 1 week ago (2 children)

i expected blahaj.zone to have more bans since as far as i know its supposed to be a safe place and less tolerant of transphobia (along with there being no downvotes to bury hateful comments and posts)

[–] hildegarde@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 points 1 week ago (7 children)

I'm also surprised. I expected higher numbers from the instance that describes itself as

a server that is very protective of our minority members and bigotry of any variety will be squashed with great prejudice.

Or perhaps I should be delighted that few bans are needed to achieve it.

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[–] PolarKraken@lemmy.dbzer0.com 10 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (12 children)

"Hey everyone, look at my juvenile attempts at statistics! Look how obviously bad some people seem when I do a shit job at it while ALSO failing to apply any context of the domain being studied to my thoughts, let alone to my 'calculations' and conclusions!"

This is a terrible metric from the fucking jump. And you did a shit job of it from there. Fuck you, truly.

[Edit: love how ya closed with "so who's weirder guyz, the marxists, the furries, or the db0s?!" Just painfully obvious how you started the whole shebang, you hate all of the groups lol, because you're a dumb asshole and not very happy about being one. Just remember, the option is always yours to simply shut the fuck up and read, then think, instead.]

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[–] Cataphract@lemmy.ml 9 points 1 week ago

I don't know why but the way this post was written made me read it in Tim Pool's voice. Guess I gotta lay off majority report videos for a while now. Glad to see push back and acknowledgement in the comments that this data is irrelevant. It's neat, but way too many factors and stretching of meanings which makes this a worthless analysis (with a very blatant bias in the reporting).

[–] imaqtpie@sh.itjust.works 9 points 1 week ago

While it's fair to note that this is a pretty raw assessment of the data and could potentially be skewed by any number of variables that aren't being accounted for, it agrees with my anecdotal experience and therefore I choose to believe it.

Some servers take a more laissez faire approach and others take a more authoritarian approach, and that's fine because joining a server is a voluntary act. No one is being subjected to anything unwillingly, they are choosing an experience that works for them.

Tangentially related ruminations

But I think it's definitely valuable for people to recognize and be aware of the fact that certain servers tend to censor dissenting voices and create a walled garden environment. This is not inherently a bad thing, but it can be frustrating when users develop fairly extreme viewpoints as a result of this curated environment, and then react strongly when confronted with more mainstream perspectives.

It's good to explore different perspectives and see what the mainstream is getting wrong, but if you insulate yourself from the mainstream entirely, you kinda reduce your ability to actually challenge it. Like you can follow your own intellectual path and end up wherever you end up, but that's a solo mission. If you feel like where you ended up intellectually is better than where you started and you want to share that with others, you actually need to walk back down the path, reconnect with the mainstream, and lead others step by step down your alternate path.

It's not effective to just stay in your obscure branch and yell at people about how wrong they are, you need to actively lead them through the sequence of rational steps that got you from point A to point B. And in many cases, they will nitpick and try to disagree at each step, because there's an inherent inertia where humans simply don't like to change their opinions unless it becomes absolutely unavoidable. Furthermore, the intellectual path that you followed could just be straight up wrong/illogical, and the opinions you are trying to change could actually have been right all along, and you might be the one who is actually wrong. So it's a very scary thing to engage in such a way.

[–] maam@feddit.uk 9 points 1 week ago (4 children)

Lemmy.ml is marxist-leninist not marxist. The distinction is very important considering that the former term was created by the tyrant Stalin.

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[–] artyom@piefed.social 8 points 1 week ago

Ah shit, I don't know what to make of this, but it's juicy

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