this post was submitted on 26 Jun 2024
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[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Maintaining that an Apartheid state has the right to keep being an Apartheid state is very Nazi-like.

[–] snooggums@midwest.social -1 points 2 years ago (4 children)

A country being shitty doesn't mean they don't have a right to exist. Does Russia not have a right to exist? Did Iraq not have a right to exist?

[–] rockmeat@feddit.org 1 points 2 years ago

no state has a right to exist. None of them.

[–] theacharnian@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

White South Africa did not have the right to exist. Rhodesia did not have a right to exist.

That's what we are talking about.

Israel has become a Jewish supremacist apartheid state. Its crimes have become so egregious and so entrenched ("facts on the ground") that it is not unreasonable to argue that it cannot be reformed in its present form. In this case it is reasonable to argue for its replacement by a democratic successor state in which Jews and others will all have the same rights to freedom and safety.

[–] snooggums@midwest.social -1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

So funny story, South Africa was able to end apartheid without not existing.

Imagine that!

[–] theacharnian@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

Wake me up when Israel institutes universal suffrage and legal equality for everyone from the river to the sea, elects Marwan Barghouthi as president and changes it flag and anthem to incorporate Palestinian national symbolism. If such a country would like to still call itself Israel, I will be happy to be proven wrong.

Because this is what ending apartheid means, buddy. Not just getting rid of Netanyahu, but deep structural change, and a commitment to justice, truth and reconciliation.

[–] NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io 1 points 2 years ago

Countries, as a rule, don't have a right to exist. People have a right to self-determination. These are different things. That said, Israel is fundamentally an Apartheid state. If Israel stopped being an Apartheid state it'd stop being Israel. And if a state needs to treat half the people in it as second class citizens to exist then it can go die in a ditch.

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

Do you mean you support Russian ownership of Crimea?

[–] snooggums@midwest.social -1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

No, because Crimea is part of Ukraine.

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

What makes it different from Israel on occupied Palestine?

[–] snooggums@midwest.social -1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

Honestly, time. Time eventually changes things and Russia's occupation of Crimea was only a decade ago and the founding of Israel was like 80 years ago. Israel's continued expansion and settlement is wrong and comparable to Russia occupying Crimea.

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

Then why isn't Germany recognizing Palestine? Those people have been there quite a while.

Only the 75 year old Israel appears to enjoy existence for Germany. Of course supporting Israel's now open and blatant annexation of the West Bank and planned annexation of Gaza.

[–] snooggums@midwest.social -1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Germany should recognize Palestine!

But the fact that they don't doesn't mean they shouldn't be actively opposing antisemitism in Germany. Opposing Israel's actions is different than "Israel shouldn't exist" because in the context of Germany and the neo mazid, not existing is literal and includes the people of Israel.

[–] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

Germany is famous for being a primary enabler of the Genocide in Gaza. Only beaten by America the original Nazis from Manifest Destiny.

Supporting the white nationalist ethnostate of Israel only solidifies the Nazi reputation of Germany being as strong as ever.

This pretense of antisemitism is just a dogwhistle for white nationalists to hide their racism

[–] snooggums@midwest.social -1 points 2 years ago