This is a community in the spirit of "Am I The Asshole" where people can post their own bans from lemmy or reddit or whatever and get some feedback from others whether the ban was justified or not.
Sometimes one just wants to be able to challenge the arguments some mod made and this could be the place for that.
All posts should follow this basic structure:
Expect to receive feedback about your posts, they might even be negative.
Make sure you follow this instance's code of conduct. In other words we won't allow bellyaching about being sanctioned for hate speech or bigotry.
YPTB matrix channel: For real-time discussions about bastards or to appeal mod actions in YPTB itself.
Some acronyms you might see.
Relevant comms
Honestly, you should've just known to not engage. Nothing productive will ever come out of it. That troll was already banned a long time ago, why dredge this back up?
Honestly, you should’ve just known to not engage. Nothing productive will ever come out of it. That troll was already banned a long time ago, why dredge this back up?
Because the issue of 196 came up, and it was said that the only people who were driven off of Blahaj were nasty transphobes. I pointed out that comments were removed and people were banned for comments as mild as "Dragons don't exist" or "I disagree with this."
LITERALLLYYYYYY like get over ittttt!
OP has actively said dozens of times they don’t intend to participate in any LBZ community ever again and has blocked the instance. Whether the rule is “good” or not aside, it’s so cringe of OP to be butthurt about it.
YDI
Like it or not, it is a widely known fact that the exact things you said are instance bannable.
The instance rules as they exist are explained in multiple places, and it is our choice as users to either follow them or stay away. If we choose to do neither of those, banning is the only real tool an admin has with current lemmy development. If there were other options available, and the instance ban was applied as a first step, I'd say PTB (though it would be PTA in this case).
Seriously, I get that the world as a whole, and each given language has to figure out what is and isn't a gender, what is and isn't going to become part of the consensus of a language. I have my own opinion about that line, but this isn't the venue for that.
But that instance, they have drawn their line, and did so last year, before the events in these screen shots. It's like travelling to another US state, there are going to be some laws that differ, and it's the travelers responsibility to follow them even if they disagree with them, or there are consequences.
I get it, I do. But, I'm sorry, this is absolutely on you.
The problem here to my mind is that this was a ban for a "thought crime" and it was on another instance. OP always uses peoples preferred pronouns, even if he thinks they don't make sense, as in this case, so he hasn't broken any instance rules afaik. Is there a rule about not being allowed to even discuss neopronouns? On another instance? That is getting very dystopian imo. Unless someone can point to a rule that says you can't even discuss the topic of neopronouns, then this is clearly a case of over-reach imo. PTB
You're still mad about this? YDI.
I don't misgender you when you say something stupid, because I don't misgender anyone for being stupid. My girlfriend held me emotionally hostage for the final 3 years of our relationship, and I don't misgender her despite me helping her come to terms with being trans and helping her transition.
I get it Pug, you're just really wanting to do something dehumanizing to someone you don't like. I don't like Drag, and I also don't like Grail. You know what I did? I blocked them both. I didn't go "well sure you identify as that, but fuck you I don't wanna bother with any of that."
Weird how no one tries to argue for the right to deadname or misgender horrid people who've committe actual horrid actions, but someone was a dick on the internet? "I NEED TO NOT HAVE MY FREEZE PEACH REMOVED TO CALL SOMEONE SOMETHING THEY AREN'T"
Pug, you're a smart person. I know you are. You have written about complex topics decently well to where I can understand it. I don't think you're somehow a secret transphobe, you just have a blind spot you can get a better mirror to have an introspection at. I've had my own issues with neopronouns that I am still working on myself. A friend of mine uses it/its pronouns, and I have a hard time to use it when speaking, but not in text. I've also had biases with other statuses of people they can't control, such as plural/systems.
How many months have you been hung up about Drag? It's more than your time could have been spent with something better about yourself or those around you.
You've been told repeatedly by Ada and other admins "Stop it, you have no proof they're lying about their pronouns, you can block and move on." and you kept going. If the shoe was on the other foot where a Tankie constantly bothered you, you'd advocate for them to be banned from their instance/places you frequent.
At some point Pug, you have to learn to be better. You've had months. It takes time to learn better, no one is perfect out of the womb. But I don't think you are trying to learn, you're just drawing a line in the sand of "Well I can agree with everything about queer people but these queer people, they bother me."
I get it Pug, you’re just really wanting to do something dehumanizing to someone you don’t like.
Uh, is that what I want? Drag is incidental to this at most.
How many months have you been hung up about Drag? It’s more than your time could have been spent with something better about yourself or those around you.
Again, Drag is incidental to this at most. If you want to make this an issue of my personal feelings, it would be far more correct to say it's about my personal feelings on Blahaj and how the admins handled the entire situation. I would argue that my personal feelings on the situation certainly make me more acerbic, but that the fundamental argument is still about questions of principle, and I don't appreciate when I get tarred as a transphobe for daring to have any sort of disagreement and leaving Blahaj because of it.
You’ve been told repeatedly by Ada and other admins “Stop it, you have no proof they’re lying about their pronouns, you can block and move on.” and you kept going.
What the fuck are you talking about?
At some point Pug, you have to learn to be better. You’ve had months. It takes time to learn better, no one is perfect out of the womb. But I don’t think you are trying to learn, you’re just drawing a line in the sand of “Well I can agree with everything about queer people but these queer people, they bother me.”
Man, all of this effort you're going through to defend an indefensible position is insanity. The idea that no gender can ever be questioned under any circumstances is not an affirmation of anyone's gender; it is a denial that gender means anything at all.
Uh, is that what I want? Drag is incidental to this at most.
Then why are you still crying about this online drama after months? It's like if I constantly complained about an internet argument on reddit that happened in October of 2024. "I'm not bothered by it, I just gotta keep posting about how much I'm not bothered by it!"
Again, Drag is incidental to this at most. If you want to make this an issue of my personal feelings, it would be far more correct to say it’s about my personal feelings on Blahaj and how the admins handled the entire situation. I would argue that my personal feelings on the situation certainly make me more acerbic, but that the fundamental argument is still about questions of principle, and I don’t appreciate when I get tarred as a transphobe for daring to have any sort of disagreement and leaving Blahaj because of it.
"Sure I don't listen to the trans admin, I don't listen to the trans people across several instances, I don't listen to any trans people telling me I'm wrong, but I'm actually an ally!"
Hey guess what, I have disagreed with people and I'm not called a transphobe when I do. Or racist. Or sexist. Or other things. This just reminds me of "It's odd how da liburals won't let me say something, they always call me racist when I call out Obummer!"
What the fuck are you talking about?
The fact that Ada and others have given you time to learn from mistakes? Does time not exist to you and that's why you think complaining about one user for weeks is considered normal? Am I mistaking you for another PugJesus from lemmy.world who has had this issue pop up before, not just with Drag?
Man, all of this effort you’re going through to defend an indefensible position is insanity. The idea that no gender can ever be questioned under any circumstances is not an affirmation of anyone’s gender; it is a denial that gender means anything at all.
I'm personally an AMAB masc enby. I present masculine, but I am curious about if I am trans or not. I don't know if I am perfect for talking about gender, but lemme try to also state something. I have trans friends, enby friends, and agender friends. To all of them, how they express their self is important. That is often gender, sometime it's a lack of gender.
I have a good friend who's name is Bugs, pronouns are it/its. I personally have a difficult time wrapping my tongue around it in casual conversation without personally plotting the sentence ahead of time. Bugs has said that it enjoys the fact that it/its makes it feel inhumane, because it never felt human. It relates to Data from Star Trek, non-human but made in the image of humans. The fact that Bugs wants the it/its pronouns is good enough for me. I don't go "Well why should I do that? Give me proof you actually want that."
I don't personally think gender is a hard stance on anything, the common ideas of gender expression/identity were "solidified" in the Victorian era. There's been dozens of non-western gender identities that don't fit into or conform into our idea of masculine/feminine/non-binary. For some trans people, being hyper-feminine is important. For some trans people, being hyper-masculine is important. Pastels and pink, flannel and grilling.
But I also have a trans masculine friend who is exclusively He/him, named himself Incubus, and has a feminine voice, enjoys pastels and pink, browses Tumblr, does a lot of "feminine" things but doesn't give a shit that it is, due to those things make him happy.
I personally don't care what someone does if it makes them happy unless it involves a non-consenting adult. Drag involved non-consenting adults by harassing people. Drag is a massive fucking asshole. I will not defend Drag harassing others, and you can check my profile. But someone's actions aren't an excuse to just go "Well I've decided that since X thing bothers me, I don't wanna do the X thing."
I don't understand why you just refuse to let go of Drag, and this in general. Again, Pug, you are a smart person. I don't consider you an enemy to me. I consider you to have faults, like I probably do and I'm not aware of them. My friends have faults, both cis and trans and enby. But I do expect adults to eventually let go of online drama that doesn't affect them. As you yourself have said you had little to no interaction with Drag.
You can let it go, not even learning better. Just move on. You aren't.
Then why are you still crying about this online drama after months? It’s like if I constantly complained about an internet argument on reddit that happened in October of 2024. “I’m not bothered by it, I just gotta keep posting about how much I’m not bothered by it!”
"Why are you upset over being called a transphobe?? Why did you have to defend yourself??"
Uh.
Might be because I don't feel that denying the existence of dragons is transphobic, and I deeply resent being labeled as such?
“Sure I don’t listen to the trans admin, I don’t listen to the trans people across several instances, I don’t listen to any trans people telling me I’m wrong, but I’m actually an ally!”
Okay, so what about the trans people across several instances who agree with me? They don't matter?
Only 'your side' matters. Identity is just a bludgeon for that.
Hey guess what, I have disagreed with people and I’m not called a transphobe when I do.
Careful, you denying chairgender might put you next on the list.
The fact that Ada and others have given you time to learn from mistakes? Does time not exist to you and that’s why you think complaining about one user for weeks is considered normal? Am I mistaking you for another PugJesus from lemmy.world who has had this issue pop up before, not just with Drag?
You must be, because I can only think of two times when Drag has come up for me at all - once when this whole shebang went down, and once when we had a chance encounter in a thread a month or two ago. Gender is a topic I very rarely discuss.
I have a good friend who’s name is Bugs, pronouns are it/its. I personally have a difficult time wrapping my tongue around it in casual conversation without personally plotting the sentence ahead of time. Bugs has said that it enjoys the fact that it/its makes it feel inhumane, because it never felt human. It relates to Data from Star Trek, non-human but made in the image of humans. The fact that Bugs wants the it/its pronouns is good enough for me. I don’t go “Well why should I do that? Give me proof you actually want that.”
Okay? Like I said. I used Drag's pronouns. So that clearly isn't the issue you want to read into this.
I don’t personally think gender is a hard stance on anything, the common ideas of gender expression/identity were “solidified” in the Victorian era. There’s been dozens of non-western gender identities that don’t fit into or conform into our idea of masculine/feminine/non-binary. For some trans people, being hyper-feminine is important. For some trans people, being hyper-masculine is important. Pastels and pink, flannel and grilling.
But I also have a trans masculine friend who is exclusively He/him, named himself Incubus, and has a feminine voice, enjoys pastels and pink, browses Tumblr, does a lot of “feminine” things but doesn’t give a shit that it is, due to those things make him happy.
Okay, good for all of those people? I enjoy playing with dolls, I hate filth (in the literal, not moral sense), I have no mechanical aptitude, and I browsed Tumblr religiously until the Great Porn Ban. I didn't actually consume any porn on Tumblr - I actually used to rib a friend for 'tasteful' nudes coming up on his feed - but I felt obliged to quit in solidarity.
Gender presentation is not what is being argued here, nor whether Drag was too masculine or feminine by the standards of Western society to fit as any particular gender.
I don’t understand why you just refuse to let go of Drag, and this in general. Again, Pug, you are a smart person. I don’t consider you an enemy to me. I consider you to have faults, like I probably do and I’m not aware of them. My friends have faults, both cis and trans and enby. But I do expect adults to eventually let go of online drama that doesn’t affect them. As you yourself have said you had little to no interaction with Drag.
I guess I'm not allowed to defend myself being called a transphobe in the present day. I just have to lie there and take it. RIP.
I don't consider you an enemy, for what it's worth. I recognize your username. I've seen you around. But this is a ridiculous hill.
YDI.
I don't know what this impulse is that people have to weigh in on the legitimacy of other people's genders, but I'm tired of people running to communities like this one just to lick their wounds when they get rightfully swatted across the nose.
Drag is a troll, and when you lie down with dogs you get fleas.
Don't compare that troll to dogs
Who gives a shit