this post was submitted on 24 Apr 2026
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In a Congressional hearing on Wednesday, Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) directly confronted anti-vaccine Health Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. on his rejection of germ theory—the unquestionable scientific idea that specific pathogenic microbes cause specific diseases. After Kennedy defended his fringe view, Senator Bill Cassidy fact-checked and debunked Kennedy’s denialist arguments in real time.

The exchanges mark a rare instance in which Kennedy’s dismissal of germ theory has been raised in such a high-profile public setting, in this case, a hearing of the Senate Committee on Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions. Kennedy, who has no background in science, medicine, or public health, is well known as an ardent anti-vaccine activist and peddler of conspiracy theories. But his startling rejection of a cornerstone theory in biomedical science has mostly been underreported.

As Ars Technica reported last year, Kennedy wrote about his germ theory denialism explicitly in his 2021 book The Real Anthony Fauci. In it, Kennedy maligns germ theory as a tool of pharmaceutical companies, scientists, and doctors to promote the use of modern medicines. Instead of accepting germ theory, Kennedy promotes a concept akin to the discarded terrain theory, in which diseases stem not from germs, but from imbalances in the body’s inner “terrain.” Those imbalances are claimed to be caused by poor nutrition and exposure to environmental toxins and stressors. (In his book, Kennedy erroneously labels this as “miasma theory,” but that is a different theory that suggests diseases derive from breathing bad air, vapors, or mists from decaying or corrupting matter. The idea was supplanted by germ theory, while terrain theory was never widely accepted.)

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[–] tgirlschierke@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 57 minutes ago
[–] RonnyZittledong@lemmy.world 5 points 1 hour ago

We truly live in the golden age of the moron.

[–] casualvagrancy@lemmy.world 2 points 1 hour ago

As usual this is all made up and none of it happened

[–] NotMyOldRedditName@lemmy.world 9 points 2 hours ago* (last edited 2 hours ago)

So he'll eat a Listeria salad and an Ecoli burger, washed down with some Girardia river water and think it was his bodies imbalance that made him sick???

[–] uberdroog@lemmy.world 28 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

How is that even something I have to Read? Fuck these morons.

[–] massacre@lemmy.world 16 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

This guy is in charge of the CENTER FOR DISEASE CONTROL. Not only responsible for the health of the nearly 400M US Citizens, but really globally in many ways. And this failson thinks you can sweat away ebola with some fucking supplements... that he happens to peddle.

[–] GenChadT@infosec.pub 6 points 2 hours ago

I love the term "failson". It's such an apt description for these grifting fuckups.

When he dies, I hope they do an autopsy of his body to see how many parasites and infections he had.

[–] ArmchairAce1944@discuss.online 19 points 5 hours ago

It is insane to think that he is endorsing a theory that was widely rejected even by Miasma guys in the 19th century.

The miasma advocates were wrong, but they still did many things that were beneficial. The first water treatment plants that provided the first safe drinking water were advocated for by miasma advocates, and the London sewer system, one that is still being used today was also built by them.

Terrain theory? They did jack shit. Just a bunch of crazy nuts who rejected both miasma and germ theory in the late 19th century.

[–] CorneliusTalmadge@lemmy.world 10 points 5 hours ago

You mean environmental toxins like germs?

[–] wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz 3 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

Those imbalances are claimed to be caused by poor nutrition and exposure to environmental toxins and stressors. (In his book, Kennedy erroneously labels this as “miasma theory,” but that is a different theory that suggests diseases derive from breathing bad air, vapors, or mists from decaying or corrupting matter.

I mean, let's not pretend that poor nutrition, environmental toxins and stressors, polluted air, and volatile gases don't contribute to disease.

Some diseases are bacterial, yes. RFK Jr.'s denial of germ theory is asinine, and his comprehension of the ideas he promotes is probably tenuous and inane. I'm not claiming that he's on to something.

But let's not lie to ourselves. Let's not fall for the stupidity by running clear to the opposite end of the stupidity.

Disease is complex and often precipitated by multiple factors. And environmental, toxicological, nutritional, and nervous factors absolutely do contribute to disease.

[–] baggachipz@sh.itjust.works 10 points 2 hours ago (1 children)

Ok, but the guy flat-out rejects absolute and established truth.

[–] wonderingwanderer@sopuli.xyz 1 points 1 hour ago (1 children)

Right, this wasn't an endorsement of him. There are perfectly legitimate arguments you can make about why he's an idiot and why him being in his current position is a danger to public health.

But saying "he's wrong because he thinks disease is caused by environmental toxins and poor nutrition" is missing a lot of nuance, and is also harmful.

Microplastics? BPAs? PTFEs? So many other examples: from papermills, textiles, coal plants, fertilizers, meat production. All these can have harmful effects when concentrated near population centers, especially upstream of water sources.

I get that RFK jr. isn't talking about those things, and probably thinks they're fake. But those are all environmental toxins, and when you summarily dismiss the idea of toxins causing disease, these all get caught in the crossfire.

[–] baggachipz@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 hour ago

Oh I certainly don’t dismiss those at all. Of course environmental toxins and other hazards harm our health. RFK is basically at the point of “humours” and blood-letting and leeches. Even if he says that environmental harms exist, he is still citing long-debunked pseudoscience. I’m sure he thinks it’s nothing a little beef tallow won’t solve, though.

[–] leoj@piefed.social 103 points 10 hours ago (3 children)

yikes, dude is gonna be draining the four humors.

[–] pdxfed@lemmy.world 23 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

Who's the barber here? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edIi6hYpUoQ

What was only recently satire is an actual position.

They will kill you and your kids.

[–] leoj@piefed.social 14 points 9 hours ago

Hopefully not me, I follow medical science, although obviously herd wide health practices will suffer which may result in higher mortality for everyone, even those who follow medical science.

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[–] nulluser@lemmy.world 27 points 8 hours ago (2 children)

Those imbalances are claimed to be caused by poor nutrition and exposure to environmental toxins and stressors.

So, like swimming in streams polluted with sewage?

[–] end_stage_ligma@lemmy.world 3 points 2 hours ago

like inhaling Trumps dookie stank

[–] danekrae@lemmy.world 7 points 8 hours ago
[–] yucandu@lemmy.world 2 points 4 hours ago

Lysenkoism.

[–] Entertainmeonly@lemmy.blahaj.zone 56 points 10 hours ago (2 children)

The Horseman known as Pestilence.

[–] scytale@piefed.zip 3 points 5 hours ago (2 children)

There’s also already a horseman for War. Who would be Death and Famine I wonder?

[–] oce@jlai.lu 1 points 49 minutes ago

Famine, whoever is in charge of cutting funds for humanitarian projects the USA were supporting and threatening millions of lives.

[–] wookiepedia@lemmy.world 3 points 1 hour ago

Famine is Brooke Rollins, secretary of department of agriculture.

[–] kylie_kraft@lemmy.world 40 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

A kind of Terry Pratchett, Good Omens version, absolutely. "We don't actually have to make new plagues, we just convince enough people that the natural plagues they've already got don't exist, or the causes aren't what they've been told, or that the treatments do greater harm than the disease. In fact, we don't even have to deceive that many. A handful of posts to alternative medicine, conspiracy, and mom's net forums, and human nature will do the rest."

[–] ArmchairAce1944@discuss.online 5 points 5 hours ago

I need to read that one. Terry was a goddamn genius who got taken from us too soon.

[–] scytale@piefed.zip 57 points 10 hours ago (2 children)

I bet he doesn't wash his hands after using the bathroom. Also, does he not visit the dentist? He should stop getting his teeth cleaned/checked if he thinks germs don't cause disease.

[–] floofloof@lemmy.ca 66 points 9 hours ago* (last edited 9 hours ago) (5 children)

Pete Hegseth bragged on TV that he had not washed his hands in 10 years, because "germs are not a real thing." These are stupid people.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-47201923

[–] WhiskyTangoFoxtrot@lemmy.world 5 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

These are stupid people.

And yet they were able to fully take over the United States government. Really says something about the movements and institutions opposing them.

[–] matlag@sh.itjust.works 2 points 56 minutes ago

Says more about the fragility of democracies. For other countries, the warning should be clear: do not fucking defund public education, do not restrict education.

Unfortunately, we keep electing people who defund education, because it's expensive, and then cry that people vote for morons who waste away tens or hundreds of billions of dollars...

[–] TrickDacy@lemmy.world 3 points 5 hours ago

Wowwww, somehow that honestly surprises me that even one of these magats could be this blindingly moronic

[–] SeeMarkFly@lemmy.ml 16 points 9 hours ago

To be fair, when he was young his parents put his swing too close to the wall.

[–] Catoblepas@piefed.blahaj.zone 11 points 9 hours ago

Fuckin Typhoid Mary. Can’t we exile him to an island for the rest of his life, too?

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[–] SGGeorwell@lemmy.world 33 points 10 hours ago (9 children)

This is all an attempt by the rich to reduce numbers of poor people. They need more people dying, so they’re going to pull out all the safety features we’ve built into our society to prolong life.

[–] sundray@lemmus.org 9 points 7 hours ago (1 children)

To reduce the number of non-working poor people. Or “useless eaters” as the psychotic, billionaire class calls them.

Or “useless eaters” as the psychotic, billionaire class calls them.

More projection, I see

[–] GeekyOnion@lemmy.world 25 points 9 hours ago (1 children)

Less “reduce the number,” and more “make the poor more tractable.” The rich still need human carpet to walk on, they just need it to be uneducated, fecund, and desperate to get under their feet.

[–] birdwing@lemmy.blahaj.zone 10 points 7 hours ago

Also divided. A divided proletariat (class of wage earners) can make less of a fist against the elite.

[–] Semi_Hemi_Demigod@lemmy.world 13 points 8 hours ago (2 children)

This contradicts their insistence that children should have children to stop population decline

[–] howl2@lemmy.zip 2 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

Not really. What they want is for the older generation that has greater disability and likely hood to be drawing on services or retirement accounts to die off. Getting younger people to pop out more worker bees is how they keep the tax revenue flowing into social security etc and never have to pay out if they can kill off the infirm/ unprofitable.

[–] howl2@lemmy.zip 1 points 3 hours ago

Average life expectancy is dropping in the us while retirement age has increased by a decade. The two numbers are only something like 5 years separated now, maybe 7. Idk Im not looking it up right now.

[–] floofloof@lemmy.ca 12 points 7 hours ago* (last edited 6 hours ago)

Right-wing politics has always been an incoherent ragbag of momentarily convenient positions, insincerely held.

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