this post was submitted on 05 May 2025
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[–] AllNewTypeFace@leminal.space 180 points 17 hours ago (15 children)

From what I’ve read, Japan’s work ethic has been more about presenteeism than productivity for a while. While long hours are the norm, it’s more important to be seen to be working than to be productive, so you don’t leave before the boss does, but you do spend a large amount of that time staring out the window or otherwise idling.

[–] jubilationtcornpone@sh.itjust.works 48 points 15 hours ago (7 children)

I worked at a place where basically every other department would stand in the lobby at 4:58 PM, waiting for accounting (which was on the other side of the building) to leave. If you didn't wait, the CEO would likely see you from his office window and you'd be getting a "talking to" by your supervisor the next day. I have never before or since worked anywhere where I've seen so much collective time wasting, trying to keep up the appearance of being busy.

This was an American company. I don't miss that shit hole in the slightest.

[–] Shirasho@lemmings.world 45 points 15 hours ago (4 children)

America has a mentality of "I'm paying you for your time, not the quality of your work." Even if you complete the work assigned to you they will throw a hissy fit if you leave one minute early because that is one minute they are paying you that you arent available if something goes wrong.

It's all ass backwards because it is cheaper in the short term to pay for cheap labor with low reliability and high availability than for expensive labor with high reliability and medium to low availability. If you take the high availability away from the former you are left with nothing.

[–] gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works 3 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

Which, as a salaried engineer, is the stupidest fucking thing ever, and something I’ve dealt with over the vast majority of my career. You pay me to solve problems, not warm a chair and look over my shoulder. If you give me stupid metrics to hit (coughRTO metricscough), I’m going to maliciously comply and hit them in a stupid way that you won’t like, but that still abides by the rules and regs. If you are the problem, I will solve you.

[–] ijedi1234@sh.itjust.works 19 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

Doing a good job is also self-defeating.

Managers want to see you grow every year. If you do your best early on in your career, you will hurt your ability to show growth that's visible to management. Therefore, the optimal solution is to do a better job by a barely perceptible amount every year, staying under your maximum quality output until you're retired/dead.

[–] ICastFist@programming.dev 4 points 1 hour ago

The reward for good work is more work

[–] Willy@sh.itjust.works 4 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

depends on what you do. I've only seen that when working at a corporate grocery store as a teen. after that I've been surprised how it wasn't that way at all even though I was always told in school it would be that way. every other workplace I've been in (office jobs) has treated everyone like an adult. get your work done and do it well and do what you need to do that. I've been pretty lucky I guess

[–] ijedi1234@sh.itjust.works 3 points 11 hours ago

You are lucky. Office jobs with stack ranking are rife with backstabbers and politics.

[–] Reverendender@sh.itjust.works 6 points 14 hours ago

This is one reason I hope to never leave my sweet WFH gig

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